"There's no Middle Ground" ???

[Mark Elliott]

I rarely post political but this struck me this week. I was monitoring another station this week and heard a President Trump spot with a voter making the case to vote to reelect and ended comments with this statement ..

"There is no Middle Ground".

This strongly concerns me. After this election, everyone will still have the same opinions, same beliefs and same politics. I've always believed in a "third way" - not a compromise, but a consensus. Good businesses are run this way. While the election might be a zero-sum game, governing can't be. If there is no "middle ground" do we even have a governable country?

Discuss.

[screen glare]

No middle ground in Putin’s Russia. Or Kim’s North Korea. Or any other dictatorship.

However here in a representative democracy
where free people can vote in fair elections and there are three branches of government checking and balancing each other so one branch becomes more powerful than the others - we CAN find middle ground.

The unprecedented monkey wrench tossed into the works recently is a president who’s mentally ill, utterly lawless, and an expert con artist. So much so that 40% of voters would not vote him out were he to shoot someone dead on Fifth Avenue for no reason.

It’s the Jim Jones style of leadership where followers are so hypnotized they’ll drink poison and die AND give it to their children if he tells them to do it.

[km1125]

When you have half the country wanting to let government control everything it's just a matter of time.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."

We're headed that way quickly.

[MotorCityRadioFreak]

I rarely post political but this struck me this week. I was monitoring another station this week and heard a President Trump spot with a voter making the case to vote to reelect and ended comments with this statement ..

"There is no Middle Ground".

This strongly concerns me. After this election, everyone will still have the same opinions, same beliefs and same politics. I've always believed in a "third way" - not a compromise, but a consensus. Good businesses are run this way. While the election might be a zero-sum game, governing can't be. If there is no "middle ground" do we even have a governable country?

Discuss.

When you have an autocracy, there is no room for moderates. Authoritarianism demands sides.

[Rate This]

When you have half the country wanting to let government control everything it's just a matter of time.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."

We're headed that way quickly.

Yes we are... 3 of the 4 federal government elements are controlled by that party currently. Except in this case it’s the minority hijacking the majority view. As for all this fear that the sky will fall if Democrats get in... I’ve got $10 million in a Nigerian bank account and if you’ll send $10,000 we can pay to get it out.

[Mark Elliott]

When you have half the country wanting to let government control everything it's just a matter of time.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."

We're headed that way quickly.

Interesting, can you source this quote? How does a dictatorship get established without the support of the majority? Also, how does it explain the very long and somewhat successful "constitutional monarchy" that seems to exist in Britain?

We have a two party system that controls the election process. In places like New Zealand, the newly re-elected leader has to form a government by getting help from parties other than hers. That forces a need for something like "middle ground". In any case, can anyone see a American dictatorship in the near future?

[Matt]

When you have half the country wanting to let government control everything it's just a matter of time.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."

We're headed that way quickly.

Yes we are... 3 of the 4 federal government elements are controlled by that party currently. Except in this case it’s the minority hijacking the majority view. As for all this fear that the sky will fall if Democrats get in... I’ve got $10 million in a Nigerian bank account and if you’ll send $10,000 we can pay to get it out.

There are three partisan "elements". The Supreme Court is NOT controlled by parties.

[bmw]

...If there is no "middle ground" do we even have a governable country?

The short answer is "no."

The longer answer is that it is difficult to find middle ground between one group of people who wants America to continue to be America and another group of people who believes that our founding was so inherently flawed that we need to start over. Those 2 groups of people have very little in common, and if there's one thing I've learned about the left, it is that they don't stop, ever, even after they've reached their goals. The far left in this country will, for the next 50 years (if we're even still a country for that amount of time), pursue their ultimate goal of tearing down every single institution we built 200+ year ago and rebuilding them into a leftist utopia. They've decided to start with law enforcement. They won't stop until every law enforcement unit in the United States is rebuilt into the form THEY want. You mark my words. This will be a decades-long pursuit. Then they'll move onto other things. Schools. Banks. Courts. Government. It'll never end.

The question is, how many more people on the "moderate" left get infected by this disease.

[Rate This]

When you have half the country wanting to let government control everything it's just a matter of time.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."

We're headed that way quickly.

Yes we are... 3 of the 4 federal government elements are controlled by that party currently. Except in this case it’s the minority hijacking the majority view. As for all this fear that the sky will fall if Democrats get in... I’ve got $10 million in a Nigerian bank account and if you’ll send $10,000 we can pay to get it out.

There are three partisan "elements". The Supreme Court is NOT controlled by parties.

If you believe this you should give me $10,000. If you do I’ll get you a cut of the $6,000,000 I have in a bank account in the Cayman Islands.

The court is already hearing and ruling on STATE LEVEL election cases. Something that they previously have Stayed out of, especially this close to an election. The Supreme Court is simply an appendage of whatever side controls it and nothing more. It’s also way over its authority and needs to be reeled in, starting with the court no longer deciding the constitutionality of cases except in the narrow definitions in the constitution. All somebody needs to do is get the balls to say “Justice Robers has made his decision. Now let him enforce it”...

[Rate This]

...If there is no "middle ground" do we even have a governable country?

The short answer is "no."

The longer answer is that it is difficult to find middle ground between one group of people who wants America to continue to be America and another group of people who believes that our founding was so inherently flawed that we need to start over. Those 2 groups of people have very little in common, and if there's one thing I've learned about the left, it is that they don't stop, ever, even after they've reached their goals. The far left in this country will, for the next 50 years (if we're even still a country for that amount of time), pursue their ultimate goal of tearing down every single institution we built 200+ year ago and rebuilding them into a leftist utopia. They've decided to start with law enforcement. They won't stop until every law enforcement unit in the United States is rebuilt into the form THEY want. You mark my words. This will be a decades-long pursuit. Then they'll move onto other things. Schools. Banks. Courts. Government. It'll never end.

The question is, how many more people on the "moderate" left get infected by this disease.

You could substitute Right for Left and get to the same place. You’re also arguing that most of our institutions are untouched from 200 years ago which isn’t right either. They were massively reshaped between 1890 and world war 2... this happens from time to time. There was resistance then and there is resistance now.

One group wants the post world war 2 order to continue... that’s the Democrats. The other would like to go back to a 19th century view of every level of society for reasons that are impossible to understand... Thats Trumpism. The real Republicans (what Trump folks call RINO’s despite that being what Trump and co. are) would like their party back so that the Regan-Bush-Romney style politics can come back.

You have bought into the fear mongering hook line and sinker. You probably agree with this too:

"Under Biden, there will be no school, no graduations, no weddings, no Thanksgiving, no Easter, no Christmas, no Fourth of July, no nothing" -- Trump

It’s like something out of a parody of conservative talking points. It isn’t supposed to BE conservative talking points.

Maybe this one too?

"No fracking, no mining, no natural gas, no heating in the winter, no air conditioning in the summer, no electricity during peak hours." -- Trump in Butler, Pennsylvania, on what will happen if Biden wins

C’mon you’re smarter than listening to his bullshit. But I’m getting very tired of folks on the right talking about the Left as some sort of subhuman species or deadly virus. Quit acting like you are gods gift to political movements if you don’t mind.

[Bryce]

You have bought into the fear mongering hook line and sinker.

I can't speak for BMW, although I maybe could. I'm not buying into fear mongering from the right. I'm just assuming that that the Democrat Party is taking the Biden/Sanders Manifesto seriously and they plan on implementing it.

Have you read the entire thing? All 110 pages?

Here's a link...

https://www.npr.org/2020/07/08/88918923 ... presidency

And, FWIW, they've already taken over our public schools.

[Rate This]

You have bought into the fear mongering hook line and sinker.

I can't speak for BMW, although I maybe could. I'm not buying into fear mongering from the right. I'm just assuming that that the Democrat Party is taking the Biden/Sanders Manifesto seriously and they plan on implementing it.

Have you read the entire thing? All 110 pages?

Here's a link...

https://www.npr.org/2020/07/08/88918923 ... presidency

And, FWIW, they've already taken over our public schools.

Oh the humanity! Forgive me if I don’t find a hell of a lot wrong with the “Biden/Bernie manifesto”. I would also note that it’s non-binding. He doesn’t have to do anything that’s there. On the other hand they are substantive policy proposals which is more than the Republicans have given us. The Republicans don’t even have a platform this year and Trump cannot articulate a second term agenda. He can just scare people. That’s it.

[km1125]

...
But I’m getting very tired of folks on the right talking about the Left as some sort of subhuman species or deadly virus. ...

Sometimes the truth hurts.

[Rate This]

...
But I’m getting very tired of folks on the right talking about the Left as some sort of subhuman species or deadly virus. ...

Sometimes the truth hurts.

Good chat. Thanks. I’ll take the small moral victory that comes with not returning the favor of kicking a wounded elephant when it’s down.

[Bryce]

Oh the humanity! Forgive me if I don’t find a hell of a lot wrong with the “Biden/Bernie manifesto”.

It looks to me like a blueprint on how to remove personal liberty, individual property rights, local government control and the right to free association. You know, the basic principles on which our country was founded.