Roe v. Wade on the verge of being overturned?

[Honeyman]

Such bullshit....safe haven laws...an issue of life, not choice.....

Easy for men to say that shit and make laws accordingly. Of course they don't have to carry the kid for 9 months or go thru childbirth.

Are you suggesting that fathers don't have an interest equal to that of the mother in the birth of their child?

Yes.

Hate to break it to you Chief, but the courts generally feel otherwise...

I understand. I thought bmw was asking my opinion.

[bmw]

Such bullshit....safe haven laws...an issue of life, not choice.....

Easy for men to say that shit and make laws accordingly. Of course they don't have to carry the kid for 9 months or go thru childbirth.

Are you suggesting that fathers don't have an interest equal to that of the mother in the birth of their child?

Yes.

Hate to break it to you Chief, but the courts generally feel otherwise...

I understand. I thought bmw was asking my opinion.

I'll assume then that you're also opposed to men ever having to pay child support.

[Honeyman]

Such bullshit....safe haven laws...an issue of life, not choice.....

Easy for men to say that shit and make laws accordingly. Of course they don't have to carry the kid for 9 months or go thru childbirth.

Are you suggesting that fathers don't have an interest equal to that of the mother in the birth of their child?

Yes.

Hate to break it to you Chief, but the courts generally feel otherwise...

I understand. I thought bmw was asking my opinion.

I'll assume then that you're also opposed to men ever having to pay child support.

Ever? No. In some cases, yes.

[Matt]

What restrictions are you talking about? As it stands right now, everyone still has the right to an abortion. Roe has not yet been overturned.

And even if it is, tell me which states where it will then be illegal to have an abortion in the instances of non-consensual intercourse?

Moreover, between now and then, Congress could nuke the filabuster and pass into federal law the same protections currently contained in Roe. If they choose not to do so, it would be only because they think this is a political winner for them come November.

So it really comes down to politics. So much for all that fire and brimstone rightlessness about the fetus, all you guys care about is sticking it to the libs. Nice legacy.

The release of the draft was absolutely political. I can't imagine this will be released until later in June, when big decisions come down.

Why shouldn't it be political? Seems to me waiting until the elections are over to then spring this on voters is just as politically dishonest, and besides, if the GOP seems to believe this is a winning issue for them they should be welcoming the information being released prior to an election. If they win a bunch of elections because of this, swell, the people's choice will have been made. If they lose a bunch of elections because of this the people's choice will still have been made. To the best of my understanding that's how a democracy works...

The ruling will be released no later than the end of the term this June, well in advance of the election.

[Lester The Nightfly]

What restrictions are you talking about? As it stands right now, everyone still has the right to an abortion. Roe has not yet been overturned.

And even if it is, tell me which states where it will then be illegal to have an abortion in the instances of non-consensual intercourse?

Moreover, between now and then, Congress could nuke the filabuster and pass into federal law the same protections currently contained in Roe. If they choose not to do so, it would be only because they think this is a political winner for them come November.

So it really comes down to politics. So much for all that fire and brimstone rightlessness about the fetus, all you guys care about is sticking it to the libs. Nice legacy.

The release of the draft was absolutely political. I can't imagine this will be released until later in June, when big decisions come down.

Why shouldn't it be political? Seems to me waiting until the elections are over to then spring this on voters is just as politically dishonest, and besides, if the GOP seems to believe this is a winning issue for them they should be welcoming the information being released prior to an election. If they win a bunch of elections because of this, swell, the people's choice will have been made. If they lose a bunch of elections because of this the people's choice will still have been made. To the best of my understanding that's how a democracy works...

The ruling will be released no later than the end of the term this June, well in advance of the election.

So the GOP should be happy they've been given extra time to justify it. More winning!!! It appears this little kerfuffle has been nothing but a positive for the Republicans going into the mid-terms. Heck even Gorsuch, Coney Barrett and the drunk rapey frat boy come out of this smelling like a rose that there's evidence they bullshitted their way onto the court but still got the gig. Well played.

[km1125]

Keep up with the news, blanket restrictions are already in place. If you want to find some moral equivalency in not wearing a mask verses the distinct possibility that at Thanksgiving dinner you'll be sharing a meal with the man who raped your daughter (who also, by the way, could be Uncle Frank), go right ahead. I wouldn't expect any different from you.

Just curious how any law allowing or preventing abortion impacts that bolded statement?

Parental rights. Even if "dad" is a rapist or an incestuous relative (who well could be the woman's own father) they still have parental rights and are entitled to all that goes with those rights. Those rights may be suspended but that would mean going to court, one more opportunity to traumatize the victim, but isn't that the idea, shame the victim because she probably was asking for it anyway? If that was a concern, why wouldn't lawmakers offer exceptions?

Nope it's pass the mashed potatoes, you're part of the family now...

Again, I have no clue how you make any of those associations with laws allowing or preventing abortions.

[Lester The Nightfly]

Keep up with the news, blanket restrictions are already in place. If you want to find some moral equivalency in not wearing a mask verses the distinct possibility that at Thanksgiving dinner you'll be sharing a meal with the man who raped your daughter (who also, by the way, could be Uncle Frank), go right ahead. I wouldn't expect any different from you.

Just curious how any law allowing or preventing abortion impacts that bolded statement?

Parental rights. Even if "dad" is a rapist or an incestuous relative (who well could be the woman's own father) they still have parental rights and are entitled to all that goes with those rights. Those rights may be suspended but that would mean going to court, one more opportunity to traumatize the victim, but isn't that the idea, shame the victim because she probably was asking for it anyway? If that was a concern, why wouldn't lawmakers offer exceptions?

Nope it's pass the mashed potatoes, you're part of the family now...

Again, I have no clue how you make any of those associations with laws allowing or preventing abortions.

Well then you haven't been paying attention or are being willfully ignorant.

[Bryce]

Hate to break it to you Chief, but the courts generally feel otherwise...

Even if the father self identifies as the birthing person?

[Lester The Nightfly]

Hate to break it to you Chief, but the courts generally feel otherwise...

Even if the father self identifies as the birthing person?

I have to hand it to you Bryce, you always manage to bring the lunatic bullshit to the table. Never change. Never change.

[bmw]

I have to hand it to you Bryce, you always manage to bring the lunatic bullshit to the table. Never change. Never change.

You're one to talk. You're the one who keeps bringing up the rapist father, aka Uncle Frank who you eat Thanksgiving with, or the incestuous father who also fathered the mother, as if those examples somehow account for the majority of abortion cases.

The reality is that rape as a reason for abortion accounts for ONE PERCENT of all abortions. The other 99 percent are a result of consensual sexual intercourse where the mother decides, once she finds out she's pregnant, that a child would either interfere with her education or job, or that she cannot afford financially to raise it.

[Bryce]

I have to hand it to you Bryce, you always manage to bring the lunatic bullshit to the table. Never change. Never change.

Every board needs a Cliff Claven.

[Lester The Nightfly]

I have to hand it to you Bryce, you always manage to bring the lunatic bullshit to the table. Never change. Never change.

You're one to talk. You're the one who keeps bringing up the rapist father, aka Uncle Frank who you eat Thanksgiving with, or the incestuous father who also fathered the mother, as if those examples somehow account for the majority of abortion cases.

The reality is that rape as a reason for abortion accounts for ONE PERCENT of all abortions. The other 99 percent are a result of consensual sexual intercourse where the mother decides, once she finds out she's pregnant, that a child would either interfere with her education or job, or that she cannot afford financially to raise it.

Not unlike David Letterman told Bill O'Reilly, I think about 60% of what you say is crap, but that aside since you seem to fancy yourself as something of a stats wiz, perhaps you can run the numbers on the NIH published estimate that over 32,000 rapes/year result in pregnancy and how that squares with your one percent claim of all rapes.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8765248 ... ch%20year.

The paper came to the conclusion that some 5% of rapes result in pregnancy. That doesn't include cases of incest, like rapey father or uncle. If I said those circumstances resulted in a majority of all abortions then I'd be wrong, and I suppose all those assaults combined might in fact be 1% but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter to the 32,000 victims of rape and God knows how many victims of incest who did become pregnant because of the assault. I believe their thoughts might be more focused on the next 32,000 victims this year, the next 32,000 next year and the 32,000 after 32,000 who will face the same circumstance but without the benefit of an exemption to abort that generally is available now. Be sure and pat yourself on the back for working the numbers but it doesn't make you any less a compassionless asshole.

[Lester The Nightfly]

I have to hand it to you Bryce, you always manage to bring the lunatic bullshit to the table. Never change. Never change.

Every board needs a Cliff Claven.

LOL

[Deleted User 15783]

All right. 4 pages of comments. My thoughts on the whole thing:

I am opposed to abortion. It is a sin. Thou Shalt not Kill. If someone in my family or circle of friends was pregnant, I would be strongly urging them to not abort the child. However ....
.... I don't feel I have the right to tell Jane Doe, who I don't know, what to do with her body. None of my business.

It may not be quite on topic, but I do want to touch on my views of unwanted pregnancies. I would love to see abortion clinics go out of business. Not because it's illegal, but because they have no customers.

I personally do not know of any pregnancies due to rape.
All unwanted pregnancies I know are from just plain doing it without protection. With calculator in hand, the guy is asking the gal when's the last time she ovulated, looking to do the math for the window of opportunity he thinks he can have a nut without a rubber.

I'm honestly not kidding when I say this. We have a couple in our family with 3 kids. None were planned. ALL 3 kids, they told others "We thought it was safe" because it was a certain time of the month. Based upon my personal observations, I truly ponder just how many abortions would be needed if protection was worn EVERY time.

Which segues into another question that has been brought forth in this thread already:
Should the guy always have a say? Let me ask this:
What if common sense dictates that life would be better if the guy just wasn't in the picture? She got knocked up by some loser she honestly would rather not want around for the rest of her life. Some bum who isn't going to provide much, it will be an uphill battle getting support if she does go thru with the pregnancy, you get the idea.

Should he be told, even if she decides to keep it?

I say that because we actually do have a child in our family that's about 12 now, and the dad has no idea he's a dad. The extended family got together, decided like I said earlier, life would be nicer with him not in it. She went and stayed with family in another state once she started showing. A couple of years later, met up with a guy that does have grey matter between his ears, got married and now has two kids. And like I said, the father of the first kid has no idea.

And buckle your seatbelt for this. I do actually know 2 instances where a guy knocked up a girl on purpose to "set the hook" because it was becoming evident she wanted to end the relationship. I kid you not. And in both instances, the guy is nothing but a big headache.

[km1125]

....... I don't feel I have the right to tell Jane Doe, who I don't know, what to do with her body. None of my business. ....

I agree that no one should tell Jane Doe what to do with HER body, but I do think - as a society - we have a responsibility to that OTHER body that she's nurturing.

She has a choice - EARLY in the pregnancy - to terminate the pregnancy. At some point it's not just a pregnancy but she's developing a PERSON.

And don't anybody go saying "but maybe she doesn't know she's pregnant!". Bullshit. There's enough ways to determine now if someone is pregnant or not within the first couple weeks. Folks get a sniffle these days and get a COVID test even if they haven't been exposed to the virus anywhere. A woman doesn't get pregnant from a toilet seat or by immaculate conception -- an EVENT occurred and if the two didn't use some type of protection then there's certainly the possibility that she's pregnant and if she doesn't' want to deal with that possibility then she should address it RIGHT THEN.