Governor Whitmer strengthens Executive Order on masks

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Don't think an increase of 18% over the normal death rate is a pandemic.

It's hype.

I think 140,000 deaths in 4 months is a pandemic.... it's well beyond "normal"...

[audiophile]

Don't think an increase of 18% over the normal death rate is a pandemic.

It's hype.

I think 140,000 deaths in 4 months is a pandemic.... it's well beyond "normal"...

The way I read it was if 100 a month passes away in County X in a four month period, then 118 would passed away in this period.

[Deleted User 13307]

COVIDView weekly update for week ending 7/11

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... index.html

Based on death certificate data, the percentage of deaths attributed to pneumonia, influenza or COVID-19 (PIC) decreased from 8.1% during week 27 to 6.4% during week 28, representing the twelfth consecutive week during which a declining percentage of deaths due to PIC has been recorded. The percentage is currently above the epidemic threshold and will likely change as additional death certificates for deaths during recent weeks are processed.

The National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS) collects death certificate data from vital statistics offices for all deaths occurring in the United States. Based on death certificate data available on July 16, 2020, 6.4% of all deaths occurring during the week ending July 11, 2020 (week 28) were due to pneumonia, influenza or COVID-19 (PIC). This is the twelfth consecutive week of a declining percentage of deaths due to PIC. The percentage is above the epidemic threshold of 5.7% for week 28. Data for recent weeks are incomplete, and the PIC percentage may increase as more death certificates representing deaths during these weeks are processed.

Weekly mortality surveillance data include a combination of machine coded and manually coded causes of death collected from death certificates. Percentages of deaths due to PIC are higher among manually coded records than more rapidly available machine coded records. Due to the additional time needed for manual coding, the initially reported PIC percentages may be lower than percentages calculated from final data.

If the mortality rate continues to fall for PIC as it has for the previous 12 weeks, the Covid outbreak may fall below epidemic levels soon. This is a big if however based on the previous lag time between cases and deaths. It does appear however that either medicine has caught up with how to treat or that the more recent cases have not resulted in the same rate of severe disease as earlier in the outbreak.

As always, time will tell.

[hanson]

Whether the legislature would go along with her isn't the point. Emergency powers don't last forever. Just because we're still in the middle of a pandemic doesn't necessarily mean that time is of the essence in everything she's doing. Masks - for example - the government has had PLENTY of time to properly debate this issue and pass appropriate sunset legislation.

Well, then the legislature needs to come up with a bill. I haven't seen one yet. They are too busy working on frivolous lawsuits.

[audiophile]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

[bmw]

Don't think an increase of 18% over the normal death rate is a pandemic.

It's hype.

I think 140,000 deaths in 4 months is a pandemic.... it's well beyond "normal"...

The way I read it was if 100 a month passes away in County X in a four month period, then 118 would passed away in this period.

I'm not even sure it would be quite that high. Of those 140,000 deaths, how many of those people would have died anyways during that 4-month period absent Covid? Has anybody figured out that particular statistic?

[Deleted User 13307]

I'm not even sure it would be quite that high. Of those 140,000 deaths, how many of those people would have died anyways during that 4-month period absent Covid? Has anybody figured out that particular statistic?

The CDC has, based on the percentages of deaths attributable to a particular cause. Their data isn't political.

The mortality rate for Covid (and pneumonia + flu too) has been disproportionately high, but has been falling for 12 weeks in a row. If/when it falls below epidemic levels, it starts falling into the realm of deaths that are expected.

What's interesting to me is that the percentage threshold changes based on what week of the year it is. So today's 6.4% is an epidemic... but in peak flu season, that rate would probably not be at epidemic levels. I don't have a breakdown of what the week-by-week thresholds are for PIC epidemic levels.

I wonder if the media will ever bother to explain the real facts - especially if the mortality rate actually does fall below epidemic levels.

[Deleted User 24]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

If you are one of those people whining about your loss of liberty because you have to wear a mask, but you're saying nothing about federal agents in unmarked uniforms snatching up citizens exercising their First Amendment rights to protest, then you don't have a clue what "liberty" really means. To you, it's just a synonym for "I don't want to do what I don't want to do."

[TC Talks]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

If you are one of those people whining about your loss of liberty because you have to wear a mask, but you're saying nothing about federal agents in unmarked uniforms snatching up citizens exercising their First Amendment rights to protest, then you don't have a clue what "liberty" really means. To you, it's just a synonym for "I don't want to do what I don't want to do."

I would have to agree with you. BMW and Audiophile's concerns are crocodile tears. They don't care about liberty, they care about the political game, which their candidate is losing no matter how many tricks he tries.

I now have 82 and 65 y.o. relatives in the hospital with COVID (contracted at Church). I really don't care how they try justifying their political beliefs, it's killing people.

[Deleted User 24]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

If you are one of those people whining about your loss of liberty because you have to wear a mask, but you're saying nothing about federal agents in unmarked uniforms snatching up citizens exercising their First Amendment rights to protest, then you don't have a clue what "liberty" really means. To you, it's just a synonym for "I don't want to do what I don't want to do."

I would have to agree with you. BMW and Audiophile's concerns are crocodile tears. They don't care about liberty, they care about the political game, which their candidate is losing no matter how many tricks he tries.

I now have 82 and 65 y.o. relatives in the hospital with COVID (contracted at Church). I really don't care how they try justifying their political beliefs, it's killing people.

Yes, they ought to move to Florida, Arizona or Texas, states doing exactly as the dumbasses wish Michigan would do.

[audiophile]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

If you are one of those people whining about your loss of liberty because you have to wear a mask, but you're saying nothing about federal agents in unmarked uniforms snatching up citizens exercising their First Amendment rights to protest, then you don't have a clue what "liberty" really means. To you, it's just a synonym for "I don't want to do what I don't want to do."

You are not paying attention. I have NEVER complained about wearing a mask, in fact I wear a P100 mask, but that's where her EO's should end.

She doesn't have the authority to close businesses for months at a time, without compensation.

Police have the right to question and detain you if there is probable cause or reasonable suspicion, and especially if they are investigating a crime. I have no idea if an investigation is taking place, and neither do you. Better brush up on the law: https://www.minicklaw.com/long-can-police-detain/

What's worse siting in the back of squad car for an hour, one time, or your business being closed since March 13?

PS Based on your flawed logic, didn't they break the stay at home order/social distancing/mask laws you are indicate you are so concerned about in this thread?

[Bryce]

[Deleted User 24]

Why should they come up with a bill? They offered to form a committee and governor just unscrupulously published their offer and illegally re-issued her own EO.

If you are one of those people whining about your loss of liberty because you have to wear a mask, but you're saying nothing about federal agents in unmarked uniforms snatching up citizens exercising their First Amendment rights to protest, then you don't have a clue what "liberty" really means. To you, it's just a synonym for "I don't want to do what I don't want to do."

You are not paying attention. I have NEVER complained about wearing a mask, in fact I wear a P100 mask, but that's where her EO's should end.

She doesn't have the authority to close businesses for months at a time, without compensation.

Police have the right to question and detain you if there is probable cause or reasonable suspicion, and especially if they are investigating a crime. I have no idea if an investigation is taking place, and neither do you. Better brush up on the law: https://www.minicklaw.com/long-can-police-detain/

What's worse siting in the back of squad car for an hour, one time, or your business being closed since March 13?

PS Based on your flawed logic, didn't they break the stay at home order/social distancing/mask laws you are indicate you are so concerned about in this thread?

Free, democratic nations do not use secret police to snatch their citizens off the street and detain them without warrants or probable cause.

Fuck off and die, you bible-humping psychopath.

[Bryce]

Went out to dinner at restaurant/bar in downtown Plymouth last night. The dining area had tables spaced a bit more than six feet apart. But, the bar area was packed with people mingling about, shoulder to shoulder and not one person was wearing a mask. If one person there was infected, it could have easily passed on to a dozen or more.

Kind of a shame.

[Bryce]

Yo Vic!

Probable cause? These people were self described anarchists. They are proud of the label. They want to form a new government. Their words, not mine. That's a federal crime punishable by 20 years in prison.