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WCCW AM tower site for sale

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TC Talks
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WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by TC Talks » Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:48 pm

There is a for sale sign in front of WCCW AM's tower array... 10.43 acres. The listing has been posted since November but the sign seems new. Any thoughts?

https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/525-W-C ... /17710730/

https://radio-locator.com/info/WCCW-AM

https://www.google.com/maps/place/44%C2 ... ,17z?hl=en


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MWmetalhead
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by MWmetalhead » Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:09 pm

Either 1310's license will be returned to the FCC once the land is sold, or we'll see a request to diplex 1310 from AM 580's tower site soon.

Not sure why it would make any sense to bother with the latter; AM radio will be almost as fringe a broadcast medium as shortwave in probably 20 more years. Would an FM translator be enough to circumvent that risk? Tough to say.


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EdWalker
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by EdWalker » Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:44 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:09 pm
Either 1310's license will be returned to the FCC once the land is sold, or we'll see a request to diplex 1310 from AM 580's tower site soon.

Not sure why it would make any sense to bother with the latter; AM radio will be almost as fringe a broadcast medium as shortwave in probably 20 more years. Would an FM translator be enough to circumvent that risk? Tough to say.
As Midwestern turned in an AM license in Alpena (WATZ-AM....granted, they had a new FM to replace it), this would not surprise me.



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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by Colonel Flagg » Mon Mar 02, 2020 9:45 am

What makes this a little different, is this is a fairly new site, as AM stations go. It was constructed in the last 20 years or so...it's not a site from 1947 that's rusting away, suffering from deferred maintenance. Is WCCW's old omni site still standing?


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CK-722
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by CK-722 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:44 am

One other possibility is that this is only a part of the site. Traverse City is a much healthier market than Alpena. And WATZ 1450 was essentially replaced by an FM. Also, could this be a part of a strategy to bring their total number of properties down so they can acquire one of Henderson's? Or are they already able to?


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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by TC Talks » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:56 am

That's the whole site...but TCM's towers are 3 miles away. How does co-hosting AM work? (Moving the towers).

Image


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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by CK-722 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 11:17 am

WCCW 1310 had a CP for 50000 watts Daytime a few years ago. They also had applied for a CP for 15000 watts Daytime with a low PSSA power from the WTCM 580 site. That may have been modified for the new site. Under newer rules, they may be able to consolidate and diplex at the WTCM 580 site. They also could potentially get a Class B with at least 250 watts Night, as they no longer have to put an NIF over Traverse City. WPON and WCXI recently modified their applications like this to be Class B for Walled Lake and Fenton. The end result for WCCW would be a decent signal in the Daytime, but they wouldn't be very good if at all in Traverse City at Night. The ideal direction is straight South of Traverse City, so the signal can essentially go straight North. and the WTCM site is more Southwest. In the meantime, WDTW 1310, the old WKNR 1310 Keener 13, has returned to the air and puts a lot of interference over Traverse City at Night. I remember listening to WKNR 1310 at Crystal Lake at Night in the 1960s.

If you look at CDBS applications for WCCW 1310, you'll see that there are three superseded applications. I think it may be one of those before they modified to move.

http://licensing.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/puba ... p_sear.htm


Is THAT where they got the idea for the 486-SX?

Same (x, y, z), different (t)

Your bullet missed my trial balloon.

RTN Price. Not guaranteed. As of 12:30, 157.71 Down 0.22.

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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by CK-722 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:04 pm

It was this one. 130 lwatts Night. The NIF is 27 mV/m. Only 5 mV/m reached Traverse City, which would receive extensive interference. Since they no longer would cover Traverse City with an NIF, they could be 250 watts or more with a diplexed pattern. They could add a tower if it was beneficial. The 580 kHz tower spacings make it difficult to use all existing towers without H*** minor lobes where you don't want them.

https://licensing.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.ex ... _num=20421

The CP was granted, and then modified for the new site. The Superseded Applications were for other issues at the new site. Here's the Night Coverage Map.

https://licensing.fcc.gov/cdbs/CDBS_Att ... &exhcnum=3
Last edited by CK-722 on Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:54 am, edited 1 time in total.


Is THAT where they got the idea for the 486-SX?

Same (x, y, z), different (t)

Your bullet missed my trial balloon.

RTN Price. Not guaranteed. As of 12:30, 157.71 Down 0.22.

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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by TC Talks » Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:10 pm

Probably not worth the money when WSRT is selling for $215k


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CK-722
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by CK-722 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:47 pm

Looks like the Night pattern had another 70 degree tower. The efficiency was only slightly less than the Class B minimum efficiency at the time. Class B looks very possible to do that with the proposed Night array with different relative field and or phase of the radiators.


Is THAT where they got the idea for the 486-SX?

Same (x, y, z), different (t)

Your bullet missed my trial balloon.

RTN Price. Not guaranteed. As of 12:30, 157.71 Down 0.22.

Artificial Intelligence is a Child that needs a Parent to guide it through.

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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by NMCSpeaks » Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:39 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:10 pm
Probably not worth the money when WSRT is selling for $215k
Midwestern is selling the WCCW-AM transmitter site to pay the Promissory Note off to Langer for their purchase of WKLT which, since cash is precious for the firm, had to be purchased with the Seller holding the paper and allow the financing for this new venture.
The market consolidation currently taking place will not stem the spiraling decline of the Northern Michigan Radio Market (and for broadcast radio in general) and will prove to be of no real benefit to either MW or MG in the near or long term.
They both are simply in the act of “shuffling the chairs on the deck of a sinking Titanic.”
There still remains way too many radio signals for such a limited sized market and region.
Langer is and was no fool in getting out. Just should have been sooner.
The “sell-by date” has come and gone for radio in the eyes of retailers, both local and regionally, in the new digital age.



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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by MWmetalhead » Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:05 am

Probably not worth the money when WSRT is selling for $215k
We'll see if AM 1310 generates any positive cash flow with ESPN Radio.

If cash flow is negligible, then I agree it would be an imprudent investment. Would be better to apply for STA authority to remain silent and attempt to sell the license (or possibly donate it).

AM Radio in Northern Michigan is barely viable.


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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by CK-722 » Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:04 am

There's lots of ways to go to keep the license for now. They could ask for an STA and ask for expedited processing and diplex one of the WTCM(AM) towers with as much power nondirectional as possible. Remember that they were 5000 watts nondirectional from near the WCCW(FM) tower. Don't know if the AM tower is still there, or if it is, whether it is usable. WIND 560 and WHBY 1280 licensed nondirectional Auxiliaries for full-time use. Reducing the power would save on power bills.

Looks like the WCCW site was just the AM tower until the FM antenna was put on the same tower. Described in History Card as on Barney Rd. 2.0 miles West of Traverse City. It was 31 watts PSSA and 500 watts PSA.

https://www.fccdata.org/?lang=en&appid= ... acid=20421

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/AsrSea ... Key=106940

They could also acquire a translator for the AM.


Is THAT where they got the idea for the 486-SX?

Same (x, y, z), different (t)

Your bullet missed my trial balloon.

RTN Price. Not guaranteed. As of 12:30, 157.71 Down 0.22.

Artificial Intelligence is a Child that needs a Parent to guide it through.

NMCSpeaks
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by NMCSpeaks » Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:45 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:10 pm
Probably not worth the money when WSRT is selling for $215k
https://radioink.com/2020/03/03/the-dec ... ome-radio/



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MWmetalhead
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Re: WCCW AM tower site for sale

Post by MWmetalhead » Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:15 pm

The Infinite Dial research for the past 12 years shows how the radio has been declining in the home. “In 2008 only 4% of Americans reported having no radio in their home, as compared to 32% today.”
Bingo.

I love how some radio industry apologists (commenters on the Radio Ink site) are dismissive of the above finding.

I'm not sure why anyone would use a Smart Speaker to listen to local AM or FM radio. I doubt many Smart Speaker owners use it in such a fashion. Case in point - dopey radio execs thought the NextRadio app on smartphones would lead to greater FM radio listening, when in reality, the app turned out to be a total flop.


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