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WKAR-AM Translator

Discussion pertaining to Lansing, Jackson, Owosso, and all areas from Alma to Hillsdale
wsummers
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WKAR-AM Translator

Post by wsummers » Mon Nov 08, 2021 7:41 pm

The translator on 105.1 will be moving to 102.3 at noon on Wednesday. This will be the second move. Looks like more changes in store in the future.
https://www.wkar.org/blogs/2021-10-27/t ... -on-nov-10



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FredLeonard
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by FredLeonard » Sun Nov 14, 2021 8:52 am

'KAR has gone to pot since the professors started running it. Worst of all 'UOM constantly kicks its miserable ass.



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MWmetalhead
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by MWmetalhead » Sun Nov 14, 2021 3:03 pm

It will be interesting to see how this move impacts reception of 102.5 WIOG in the Lansing and East Lansing area. That station comes in strongly enough to lock in on seek mode in many parts of the area. It definitely outperforms the FCC circular signal strength plots in that direction.

I thought 105.1 was a decent spot, personally. I cannot help but wonder if K105.3 or 104.9 The Edge filed or threatened to file interference complaints.

The only place where reception was likely crummy was rural portions of eastern Ingham County, where 105.1 the Bounce likely overpowered the translator during tropo.


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Kennelly Heaviside
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by Kennelly Heaviside » Mon Nov 15, 2021 1:17 am

If these interference complaints and having to move all over the dial don't convince people that translators are not the answer, I don't know what will. They need a few MHz, preferably in the 76-88 MHz region used for FM radio in other countries. Many radios can already receive this band in a setup procedure. There are ways to squeeze a whole bunch (1000-2000) of moderate power STATIONS (1-3 kW/100 meters) in with a 2-4 MHz band. I even came up with a set of interference rules to do it.

They could do it like the AM Expanded Band, give them say up to 5 years to simulcast and then shut one down.


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EdWalker
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by EdWalker » Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:40 am

From the FCC application to move from 105.1 to 102.3:

"The proposed move in frequency is intended to eliminate overlap of co-channel station WMGC-FM interfering contour with the service contour of W286DC. W286DC previously reduced operating power to resolve interference complaints from WMGC-FM. The amount of overlap will be significantly reduced with a move of W286DC to CH272."



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MWmetalhead
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by MWmetalhead » Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:35 am

Wow - that's rather surprising. Didn't realize Beasley would be so protective of its signal in places like Webberville.

I don't recall ever hearing W286DC's signal cross into Livingston County, and WMGC's over the air strength has always become pretty flimsy once one heads west of the outlet mall along I-96 (i.e. the I-96 & M-59 junction).

At 102.3, they might have to deal with interference complaints from WIOG. We'll see.


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Kennelly Heaviside
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by Kennelly Heaviside » Thu Nov 18, 2021 6:42 am

WKAR 870 is far enough outside the WWL 0.5 mV/m 50% skywave contour to have enough power on a PSSA or Class B to serve the immediate campus area and the surrounding area of East Lansing. Looking at the satellite photos of the TL, it looks like you could fit a relatively low power PSSA with a DA on their existing property. Two more towers perhaps. That would mitigate the need for a translator for now. A low power phasor could be built with less beefy and expensive components.


Kennelly Heaviside. The best Technical Consultant no money can buy.

billmich88888
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by billmich88888 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:46 am

Kennelly Heaviside wrote:
Thu Nov 18, 2021 6:42 am
WKAR 870 is far enough outside the WWL 0.5 mV/m 50% skywave contour to have enough power on a PSSA or Class B to serve the immediate campus area and the surrounding area of East Lansing. Looking at the satellite photos of the TL, it looks like you could fit a relatively low power PSSA with a DA on their existing property. Two more towers perhaps. That would mitigate the need for a translator for now. A low power phasor could be built with less beefy and expensive components.
i agree with you, in 1972, or 1992, but in 2022 - AM radio is not worth investing in



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MWmetalhead
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by MWmetalhead » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:41 pm

Caught the new 102.3 earlier today; no discernible interference to WIOG along I-96 from it. My receiver does have excellent selectivity, so other folks might have a different experience than my own.

Areal coverage is very similar to the former 105.1; signal was non-existent by the Webberville exit.

Speaking of 105.1, WMGC-FM from the Detroit was already listenable near Williamston (with minor picket fencing), so indeed there evidently was a very narrow zone where the former translator interfered with WMGC-FM. Given the fact this zone was so far from WMGC's protected contour, I am surprised it became an issue.

If anyone near Toledo is thinking of foisting a translator at 105.1 MHz, be forewarned!


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Ben Zonia
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Re: WKAR-AM Translator

Post by Ben Zonia » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:41 pm

I firmly believe that the only way to solve the AM problems is to move AM stations to a new full power expanded FM band. Simulcast for five years like the AM Expanded Band, then turn one off. And no one seems to be able to make that happen.The big group owners will play both ends against the middle, holding all the cards, or they will acquire all the cards before they try. They'll put a translator on the frequency of a 40 odd mile away cochannel Class A, and prevent any stations from operating on their frequencies or adjacent. Under the old Section 73.215, for instance, you couldn't make WFBE 50 kW nondirectional from FCHS, then they changed the second adjacent rules to 40 dB U/D from 20 dB U/D, and by that time it was too late, they were taking the tower down. The station that stood in the way was not 94.9 East Lansing, or 95.1 Chatham, but the owners of WKQI 95.5, that refused to negotiate, even though they were 100 kW, and they interfered more with WFBE. That forced them to move to the WTRX tower, after eschewing the Otisville tower (probably should have stayed), and had to go directional with a much deeper null than even at the FCHS site, under much more convoluted Section 73.213 grandfathering rules. This is similar to what happened at WLAV-FM.


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