Somewhere, a PTA is missing its "Karen"

[bmw]

I predicted June 1st back in March. That prediction was based on science and the curve that the state would likely go through. Now here we are sheltering until the end of May. I don't know what you people are all excited about but it seems to me things are following the path that was predicted.

Even the IMHE says we can safely lift the restrictions on May 21.

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-s ... a/michigan

If you look at that link, that is fairly current too (April 23). Per those projections, the need for hospital resources falls to like 10% of what it was at the peak by the second week of May.

As I pointed out way back when the shutdown happened - she did it when we had only 35 reported cases, and as such, that would likely be the metric to lift restrictions (ie - 35 reported active cases).

[Deleted User 13307]

Civil disobedience is already happening, you just don't see it on TV (yet). People that do hair, for instance, are now doing it much more under the table at home than they did before... throwing out all safety and health regulations. Along with all the revenue the govt used to make from that industry.

Once these people establish they they can do better "off the grid" by double dipping (being paid in cash AND collecting unemployment) all bets are off getting them to go back to work as an employee someplace.

It's a very dangerous time.

[Rate This]

And to be clear, my thoughts about civil disobedience are entirely about people deciding en mass to just ignore the executive orders making enforcement impossible.

I am not in favor of confrontations like we saw yesterday at and in the Capitol. No one needs that kind of powder keg.

Did find out that it is legal to carry a gun in the state house... what bozo thought that one up?

[bmw]

Anybody here who has a facebook profile should follow the Michiganders Against Excessive Quarantine group - now over 375,000 members, and based on the high level of activity in that group and the comments I'm reading, it looks like the biggest form of civil disobedience moving forward is simply that a lot of small businesses are simply going to re-open their doors today, and a group of them may file a class action lawsuit if they get penalized for doing so, arguing that the executive order on which the penalty is based is unconstitutional (namely - that it violates the Michigan Constitution's separation of powers clause)

[Rate This]

Anybody here who has a facebook profile should follow the Michiganders Against Excessive Quarantine group - now over 375,000 members, and based on the high level of activity in that group and the comments I'm reading, it looks like the biggest form of civil disobedience moving forward is simply that a lot of small businesses are simply going to re-open their doors today, and a group of them may file a class action lawsuit if they get penalized for doing so, arguing that the executive order on which the penalty is based is unconstitutional (namely - that it violates the Michigan Constitution's separation of powers clause)

It’ll be interesting to see if that lawsuit makes it very far or not. The problem with that 375,000 number is that many of them may not be from Michigan. Figuring that out would be time consuming.

[TC Talks]

At this point you are all bitching to bitch. Whitmer has already won a lawsuit in conservative Oakland County, anyone who reads the EO laws will draw the same conclusion.

We are still under a federal disaster order, that provides the Governor all the justification she needs.

But keep babbling about your tyranny.

[bmw]

At this point you are all bitching to bitch. Whitmer has already won a lawsuit in conservative Oakland County, anyone who reads the EO laws will draw the same conclusion.

We are still under a federal disaster order, that provides the Governor all the justification she needs.

But keep babbling about your tyranny.

This post earns one giant STFU from me.

When you have one lone person deciding the livliehoods of 10 million US citizens (and doing so in a way so as to leave the legislative branch of government out of the process altogether), how is that anything other than a dictatorship?

[Rate This]

At this point you are all bitching to bitch. Whitmer has already won a lawsuit in conservative Oakland County, anyone who reads the EO laws will draw the same conclusion.

We are still under a federal disaster order, that provides the Governor all the justification she needs.

But keep babbling about your tyranny.

This post earns one giant STFU from me.

When you have one lone person deciding the livliehoods of 10 million US citizens (and doing so in a way so as to leave the legislative branch of government out of the process altogether), how is that anything other than a dictatorship?

As you like to point out this isn’t a democracy it’s a republic. So we elect leaders to make decisions for the rest of us. I don’t really think the legislature would have worked with her and I think this is bad blood from before coming to a head between the two. That’s what’s really at work here. But the reason the law originally didn’t require the legislature to approve any extensions is because then you get too many cooks in the kitchen. Instead of one person quickly and decisively working you get 148 cooks plus the Governor... yikes.

[bmw]

To what extent the legislature would or would not have worked with her is irrelevant (though, I think they deserve more credit than you're giving them - they gave her a 23-day, no-strings attached extension on top of the original 28 days that she claimed herself, effectively giving her the go-ahead to dictate for 51 days without interference from the legislature).

My point is that 51 days into this, we're beyond the need for quick, decisive action. Most citizens (unless you've been living under a rock for the past 2 months) are well aware of exactly what is going on. We're past the peak by at least 3 weeks now, at least here in Michigan. As such, it is time for the legislature to have a say in how we move forward. Otherwise, we still have, for better or worse, a de-facto dictatorship.

[Rate This]

To what extent the legislature would or would not have worked with her is irrelevant (though, I think they deserve more credit than you're giving them - they gave her a 23-day, no-strings attached extension on top of the original 28 days that she claimed herself, effectively giving her the go-ahead to dictate for 51 days without interference from the legislature).

My point is that 51 days into this, we're beyond the need for quick, decisive action. Most citizens (unless you've been living under a rock for the past 2 months) are well aware of exactly what is going on. We're past the peak by at least 3 weeks now, at least here in Michigan. As such, it is time for the legislature to have a say in how we move forward. Otherwise, we still have, for better or worse, a de-facto dictatorship.

But I’m saying that the legislature was ready to have her order everything opened up and let’s get on with it.. all at once and that’s why they wanted to life the state of emergency. I’m not sure that’s the right answer either...

[Deleted User 13307]

But I’m saying that the legislature was ready to have her order everything opened up and let’s get on with it.. all at once and that’s why they wanted to life the state of emergency. I’m not sure that’s the right answer either...

This is 100% false.

https://www.wxyz.com/news/coronavirus/m ... s-response

[bmw]

But I’m saying that the legislature was ready to have her order everything opened up and let’s get on with it.. all at once and that’s why they wanted to life the state of emergency. I’m not sure that’s the right answer either...

This is 100% false.

https://www.wxyz.com/news/coronavirus/m ... s-response

This plan certainly makes a lot more sense than what Whitmer is doing. I wasn't even aware it existed.

To RT - whether you agree with what the legislature would do is not the point. My point is that we live in a representative democracy whereby the state has 3 co-equal branches of government. The people elected Whitmer, but they also elected their representatives, and those representatives as a group are supposed to be equal to the governor in terms of the power they wield. Moreover, we're suppoed to be a nation of laws, and last time I checked, the legislature is responsible for writing the laws, not the governor. I know emergencies are the exception to the rule, but I'm not buying the idea that the need for executive action any longer justifies emergency powers for the governor.

[Matt]

At this point you are all bitching to bitch. Whitmer has already won a lawsuit in conservative Oakland County, anyone who reads the EO laws will draw the same conclusion.

We are still under a federal disaster order, that provides the Governor all the justification she needs.

But keep babbling about your tyranny.

This post earns one giant STFU from me.

When you have one lone person deciding the livliehoods of 10 million US citizens (and doing so in a way so as to leave the legislative branch of government out of the process altogether), how is that anything other than a dictatorship?

As you like to point out this isn’t a democracy it’s a republic. So we elect leaders to make decisions for the rest of us. I don’t really think the legislature would have worked with her and I think this is bad blood from before coming to a head between the two. That’s what’s really at work here. But the reason the law originally didn’t require the legislature to approve any extensions is because then you get too many cooks in the kitchen. Instead of one person quickly and decisively working you get 148 cooks plus the Governor... yikes.

If efficiency is your concern, then I'm sure you would be supportive of President Trump issuing a nation-wide EO reinstating liberty.

[Rate This]

At this point you are all bitching to bitch. Whitmer has already won a lawsuit in conservative Oakland County, anyone who reads the EO laws will draw the same conclusion.

We are still under a federal disaster order, that provides the Governor all the justification she needs.

But keep babbling about your tyranny.

This post earns one giant STFU from me.

When you have one lone person deciding the livliehoods of 10 million US citizens (and doing so in a way so as to leave the legislative branch of government out of the process altogether), how is that anything other than a dictatorship?

As you like to point out this isn’t a democracy it’s a republic. So we elect leaders to make decisions for the rest of us. I don’t really think the legislature would have worked with her and I think this is bad blood from before coming to a head between the two. That’s what’s really at work here. But the reason the law originally didn’t require the legislature to approve any extensions is because then you get too many cooks in the kitchen. Instead of one person quickly and decisively working you get 148 cooks plus the Governor... yikes.

If efficiency is your concern, then I'm sure you would be supportive of President Trump issuing a nation-wide EO reinstating liberty.

That’s pretty vague... places trying to implement it would invent their own meanings for that. That’s just as inefficient.

[TC Talks]

This post earns one giant STFU from me.

When you have one lone person deciding the livliehoods of 10 million US citizens (and doing so in a way so as to leave the legislative branch of government out of the process altogether), how is that anything other than a dictatorship?

Think she made that decision all by herself? I'm sorry, but any leader with the data and science we have would make similar decisions. I imagine she is being advised by many experts who are looking at this responsibly. For the record, Whitmer is a very business driven leader, it's why she and Snyder get along. She has been speaking with business leaders, BUT she also makes sure the workers are safe too.

Look at Iowa, how would you like to be a meat packer there? "Go back to work you we will starve you". That feels like the way Lee Chatfield and his henchmen think.