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Retro TV WHNE

Discussion pertaining to Detroit, Ann Arbor, Port Huron, and SW Ontario
innate-in-you
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by innate-in-you » Tue Apr 21, 2020 1:35 am

CK-722 wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:20 pm
The only antenna on the Menards website that looks like it would work for WHNE 3 is the Top Of The Line Low VHF/High VHF/UHF. The next "best" I saw for Channel 3 is similar to the antenna on the WHNE Facebook Page or website that is Xed out and says "Bad". It looks to me like that small antenna may be tuned for 5,6, and FM BC. I don't know why people are so resistant to larger antennas, which if properly designed, are better, particularly for Low VHF.
If one lives under an HOA, they are likely to be in violation. HOAs can still cite a violation if the antenna does not fit in a one-meter sphere.



innate-in-you
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by innate-in-you » Tue Apr 21, 2020 1:54 am

Winegard sells an antenna designed for triband reception in urban areas. It comes in the form of a traditional metal antenna with a short boom.

In its standard configuration, it is a VHF-High/UHF antenna, but the package includes extender rods which provides Low-VHF capability (probably functioning as a dipole).



CK-722
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by CK-722 » Tue Apr 21, 2020 6:27 am

Here's a video. Don't know if it's practical.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBNQ11uKj7w

I don't know if Winegard and Channel Master still sell Single Channel Yagis. Commercial MATV/CATV Yagis tend to be expensive.

Seems like the FCC has a rule that says you can have a home TV antenna. Remember that antennas look a lot smaller on your roof, so the HOAs might not even notice. If you get an amateur radio license, you can usually get away with a lot more.


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Tman
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by Tman » Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:23 am

Well. The coverage map is being kind with it's range because it sure does not make it out to New Baltimore for me any more . Too bad .



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windsor
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by windsor » Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:10 am

If anyone is missing their Retro TV shows like The Doctors or Dr. Who go to their website and they have it streaming there.

You don't need WHNE to watch ….. :D

https://www.myretrotv.com/watch


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WOHO
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by WOHO » Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:29 pm

Why the power drop and loss of viewers when you're already in digital noise hell-land with damn near the longest antenna elements (other than the old Ch2)?



fanniemae
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by fanniemae » Thu May 14, 2020 5:02 pm

I watched WHNE reruns of the old soap The Doctors. Since the conversion , I can't get the signal. Have tried different in house antennas . I realize I would need a new antenna. You can subscribe to Retro for a monthly fee. Not going to do that. WHNE should have applied for a better channel. I wonder if they have money problems. Last year it seemed the last 2 or 3 days of the month they had signal problems. WHNE was dark. Always the end of the month. Out of money end at the month maybe back then ? Not enough advertising dollars coming in ? WHNE had a good following of fans and the station screwed themselves over.



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WOHO
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by WOHO » Thu May 14, 2020 8:35 pm

Can WHNE apply for more power based on actual lack of coverage?



tvbobn
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by tvbobn » Thu May 14, 2020 11:34 pm

WOHO wrote:
Thu May 14, 2020 8:35 pm
Can WHNE apply for more power based on actual lack of coverage?
WHNE has explained this on their Facebook page, but here it is again.

The station now on channel 3 actually covers more area now than it did on channel 20/14 except for Canada. Canada is not in the current pattern with enough power to see the station. They had to put a null toward Canada.

It's not the lack of power, it's that many people (who think they have great antennas) don't have antennas designed to receive low VHF. If their home antenna doesn't receive low VHF, they're not going to get the station on their TV's no matter how many times they try to rescan.

It's not easy to find antennas for low VHF, but they are out there. WHNE listed several antennas that will work on their Facebook page a few weeks ago. They even tested a $45 antenna all around the Detroit area. It was hand held above an engineers head and they showed on the map where they had good signal. Anyone who lives near any of those test locations could certainly receive WHNE with an antenna designed to receive low VHF!

It's not the power of the station, it's the receive antennas at homes causing the issues.

They're working on ideas to help people get antennas, but with all the virus/stay at home orders, they have to wait it out for awhile.

I know the people that own WHNE. They picked the best channel they could find to cover a similar pattern to what they had on UHF. They spent close to $200,000 dollars to build the new channel 3. Anyone that says they were short on cash, doesn't know what they're talking about because every invoice has been paid!


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SolarMax
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by SolarMax » Fri May 15, 2020 12:19 pm

Quite recently WHNE posted a very lengthy summary of their viewing situation on its Facebook page (which I won't re-post here). Basically they've asked people to mail them (actual written mail, with an address given) their experiences (successes, problems and failures) trying to receive the new ch. 3, whether due to location or lack of ability to erect new or outdoor antenna, or whatever reasons aren't enabling them to receive the station as in the past. I'm assuming this may be part of basis for some future FCC action. It's interesting how many comments they've gotten on this, and that there has been an enthusiastic viewer base out there who really wants their offerings (or at least a few of them).
Some here may remember that WXON was able to get its allocation changed from ch 62 to ch 20, with a part of its argument being that consumer UHF tuners in the early 70s were awful at the high end of the UHF spectrum (true), so its ability to serve the public interest was throttled by poorly performing consumer products, Maybe a similar tack being thought of here.



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HD74
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by HD74 » Fri May 15, 2020 12:57 pm

Some of you may be getting the station and not know it.
I'll post this again, try it, it may just work for you.
Unhook your antenna, do a complete channel scan with no antenna.
Re-attach your antenna, do a second scan.
This will remove the old channel plan from your set, and install the current channel plan.
Yes, I do understand the difference between low, high, and UHF, but that may not be the issue for all of you.


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SixPlusOne
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by SixPlusOne » Fri May 15, 2020 2:54 pm

SolarMax wrote:
Fri May 15, 2020 12:19 pm
Some here may remember that WXON was able to get its allocation changed from ch 62 to ch 20, with a part of its argument being that consumer UHF tuners in the early 70s were awful at the high end of the UHF spectrum (true), so its ability to serve the public interest was throttled by poorly performing consumer products, Maybe a similar tack being thought of here.
Having worked at WXON at that time you have to remember that Channel 20 was available to move to. I think it's highly unlikely that WHNE is going to reapply for a different channel with all the particulars that go into that.

If I am understanding the linked application linked here WHNE has an application pending for an effective radiated power of 6.5KW


https://fccdata.org/?lang=en&appid=2507 ... cid=168737

3. MOD 0000074644 Pending 06/11/2019
View Application
View Google Map
Record Type: Digital Low Power TV Station
Application Purpose: Modification (Minor)
Channel: 3
Expiration Date: 12/07/2021
SITE # 1
NAD83 Coordinates: 42 26' 52.5" N / 83 10' 23.1" W
Elevation: 201.8 m AMSL
Antenna Type: PSI PSIVLDP3EC-3-EP
Antenna Polarization: Elliptical

Effective Radiated Power: 6.5kW
Radiation center-above mean sea level: 346.8
Overall antenna height above ground: 331.3

Antenna System ID: 1005109
Antenna Rotation: 321
Rad Field dB ERP Rad Field dB ERP Rad Field dB ERP Rad Field dB ERP
0 0.990 -0.1 6.371 90 0.843 -1.5 4.619 180 0.127 -17.9 0.105 270 0.866 -1.2 4.875
10 0.945 -0.5 5.805 100 0.726 -2.8 3.426 190 0.133 -17.5 0.115 280 0.947 -0.5 5.829
20 0.833 -1.6 4.510 110 0.592 -4.6 2.278 200 0.139 -17.1 0.126 290 0.985 -0.1 6.306
30 0.804 -1.9 4.202 120 0.457 -6.8 1.358 210 0.177 -15.0 0.204 300 0.977 -0.2 6.204
40 0.879 -1.1 5.022 130 0.340 -9.4 0.751 220 0.253 -11.9 0.416 310 0.920 -0.7 5.502
50 0.963 -0.3 6.028 140 0.244 -12.3 0.387 230 0.345 -9.2 0.774 320 0.834 -1.6 4.521
60 1.000 0.0 6.500 150 0.157 -16.1 0.160 240 0.471 -6.5 1.442 330 0.777 -2.2 3.924
70 0.985 -0.1 6.306 160 0.109 -19.3 0.077 250 0.611 -4.3 2.427 340 0.819 -1.7 4.360
80 0.931 -0.6 5.634 170 0.114 -18.9 0.084 260 0.750 -2.5 3.656 350 0.930 -0.6 5.622


Setting the station's effective radiated power aside I am convinced that the issue here is a receiving antenna issue. From the day WHNE went on Channel 3 and I did a rescan I have received all of their channels. Over 10 years ago I installed on a 1 story house using a chimney mount a Radio Shack Model VU-210 outdoor antenna. At the time it was the biggest antenna they offered. It is quite possible that it is essentially a Channel Master with the Radio Shack name on it. Many other posters in our forum have pointed out that low VHF elements are needed. I fully agree. Having just completed a search regarding low-VHF I came across some interesting links. I hope they will be of some interest.

Antenna Advice For Low VHF Channel

https://www.dtvusaforum.com/threads/ant ... nel.30760/

Low Band VHF Television Antennas
https://www.eriinc.com/product/low-band ... n-antenna/

VHF Lo Reception on VHF-Hi/UHF Designed Antennas
https://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/thread ... as.381676/

Lastly I highly recommend you view some of the videos available from Antenna Man on YouTube. He is an installer. He does not try to sell you anything. He covers every aspect of outdoor and indoor antennas with no bullshit as you will immediately discover. He tests many of the antennas that are currently on the market and will give you a frank evaluation.

Antenna Man on YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... ntenna+man

At least scroll down and view all the antennas he has tested and the free advise he offers. I hope you will view some of these and share with our forum your thoughts.



SixPlusOne
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by SixPlusOne » Fri May 15, 2020 3:21 pm

I just watched this Antenna Man clip. The third one he mentions is a lot like mine with the numerous VHF elements and he specifically mentions that it handles low VHF unlike the other two.

The Top 3 Outdoor TV Antennas from an Installer


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRsQDcehmB4



tivoking
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by tivoking » Wed May 20, 2020 11:28 am

People in apartments and condos can't be putting up pole antennas with giant masts that make it look like you're trying to tune in Tokyo. They are most likely the ones who actually can't afford cable, not someone with a big house and land, who just doesn't want to pay for cable. Poles are not a solution for millions. HD TV was half-arsed. Some might be on VHF, but their power is low or have shorter antennas or are forced to use directional, or they have interference, or...



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Retro TV WHNE

Post by MWmetalhead » Fri Aug 07, 2020 9:32 pm

WHNE seems to be a bit stronger than usual. Picking up a steady 22 to 23 dB signal with rabbit ears extended only halfway (about 18 inches) and zero dropouts. This result has been constant all week. A great, stable signal with no pixelation.

Fully extended, signal strength improves by another 2 to 3 dB.

I live 7 or 8 miles from their tower.

WDWO-DT and WPXD are about the same strength. Interestingly, I cannot get WKBD to decode on scan at all! They must be transmitting at ridiculously low power right now.


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