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The Debt Limit..

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bmw
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by bmw » Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:26 am

Uh, not even close. The net wealth of all billionaires (735 of them) living in the us is around $4.4 trillion. So even if you robbed every single billionaire of all of their wealth, thereby leaving each and every one of them literally homeless, you couldn't even pay off 15% of the national debt. And that's assuming you could liquidate all those assets at fair market value. The idea that taxing billionaires more will do much of anything to tackle our debt is pie in the sky where the math just doesn't add up.



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craig11152
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by craig11152 » Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:06 pm

bmw wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:26 am
Uh, not even close. The net wealth of all billionaires (735 of them) living in the us is around $4.4 trillion. So even if you robbed every single billionaire of all of their wealth, thereby leaving each and every one of them literally homeless, you couldn't even pay off 15% of the national debt. And that's assuming you could liquidate all those assets at fair market value. The idea that taxing billionaires more will do much of anything to tackle our debt is pie in the sky where the math just doesn't add up.
I was just tweaking my facts to post the exact same thing. :blink


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km1125
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by km1125 » Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:00 pm

bmw wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:26 am
Uh, not even close. The net wealth of all billionaires (735 of them) living in the us is around $4.4 trillion. So even if you robbed every single billionaire of all of their wealth, thereby leaving each and every one of them literally homeless, you couldn't even pay off 15% of the national debt. And that's assuming you could liquidate all those assets at fair market value. The idea that taxing billionaires more will do much of anything to tackle our debt is pie in the sky where the math just doesn't add up.
Yea, that's the actual facts.

But the lefties FEEL it will be the solution, so the facts really don't matter!

:lol



bmw
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by bmw » Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:11 pm

This hopefully also illustrates just how large our debt actually is. For more perspective, the national has grown by the equivalent of the cumulative wealth of all billionaires just since Covid, back when the debt was nearly $5 trillion less than it is today.



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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by MotorCityRadioFreak » Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:42 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 12:00 pm
I am comfortable with the charitable elements of churches getting a tax credit. But the country club, political and real estate elements of religion should not get a pass.

For example; Mel Trotter Ministries serves the unhoused without restrictions. You don't have to accept any religious dogma to receive services. This is chartered as a religious organization yet serves all (even LGBTQ).

Religious media? Absolutely should be paying taxes, as they are largely political organizations.
Agreed!


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Rate This
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by Rate This » Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:46 pm

bmw wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:11 pm
This hopefully also illustrates just how large our debt actually is. For more perspective, the national has grown by the equivalent of the cumulative wealth of all billionaires just since Covid, back when the debt was nearly $5 trillion less than it is today.
When the sugar high from tax cuts wears off after 18 months or so the hole in the budget is gaping… we have been at the tax cuts thing since Regan…. We have never cut spending to match the decreased revenue. Welcome to the results of that. But don’t worry. If we get a GOP trifecta again… TAXES ARENT LOW ENOUGH! WE NEED ANOTHER TAX CUT!



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TC Talks
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by TC Talks » Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:47 pm

km1125 wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:00 pm
bmw wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:26 am
Uh, not even close. The net wealth of all billionaires (735 of them) living in the us is around $4.4 trillion. So even if you robbed every single billionaire of all of their wealth, thereby leaving each and every one of them literally homeless, you couldn't even pay off 15% of the national debt. And that's assuming you could liquidate all those assets at fair market value. The idea that taxing billionaires more will do much of anything to tackle our debt is pie in the sky where the math just doesn't add up.
Yea, that's the actual facts.

But the lefties FEEL it will be the solution, so the facts really don't matter!

:lol
Is it a fact that the top income earners pay very little effective income tax? Certainly much less than 20% - 48% that you or I pay?

Just that fact, no hyperbole that suggests I want all their money. Should they pay an effective income tax?

(Next we will tackle spending for the Military Complex. Do we need a 785 billion dollar budget?)

Here's and oldie but goodie
https://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/77-billi ... d=13322450


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bmw
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by bmw » Thu Jun 01, 2023 2:22 pm

TCT - do your own homework. You're the one who has made the following claims:

"Billionaires pay nearly no taxes but their donations basically keep the GOP alive thanks to the gaping loopholes."

"That [the US having the 11th highest debt-to-GDP ratio] wouldn't be the case if we close the billionaires tax loopholes. We would be flush and could work on the debt."

"[it is] a fact that the top income earners pay very little effective income tax"

You haven't provided a shred of evidence for any of these claims. I accurately pointed out that the combined wealth of all billionaires in this country doesn't even add up to 15% of the national debt.

So please explain what specific "loopholes" you're talking about and how closing said loopholes would not only get billionaires to pay more in taxes, but also would get them to pay enough to have any meaningful impact on the debt and/or debt-to-GDP ratio. I mean, you've claimed that this is in fact the case, but where's your evidence?



km1125
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by km1125 » Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:03 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 1:50 pm
And Billionaires pay nearly no taxes but their donations basically keep the GOP alive thanks to the gaping loopholes Biden will hopefully close.
I haven't seen a update recently, but wasn't it proven here a while ago that most of the billionaire dollars were going into the DEM coffers, either directly or indirectly?? Zuckerberg, Soros, Steyer, Dimon, Jobs, Getty, Ballmer Lucas, Bloomberg, the whole Roberts family, Dorsey, and don't forget Sam Bankman-Fried! I put Zuck at the beginning of that list because what he did BEYOND just giving dollars was probably worth a LOT more than what the other contributed combined!!
TC Talks wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:47 pm
(Next we will tackle spending for the Military Complex. Do we need a 785 billion dollar budget?)
We can actually agree there too!! If we stopped giving away a bunch of our hardware (for virtually FREE) to other nations we probably WOULD NOT need anywhere near 785 Billion!



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MWmetalhead
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:51 pm

When the sugar high from tax cuts wears off after 18 months or so the hole in the budget is gaping...
U.S. Treasury receipts decreased a very small amount the first year the tax cuts were in effect. Thereafter, receipts grew by a decent amount and compared favorably to pre-cut levels.

The numbers are fairly easy to find. I will post a URL this evening.

Spending increases are the problem, not diminished receipts by Treasury.



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TC Talks
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by TC Talks » Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:52 pm

Let's work on this first, stripping money from the safety net second.


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bmw
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by bmw » Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:20 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 10:29 am
Now McCarthy has a moderate group of legislators to get the business of the country passed.
You ought to be happy about this then. A few moderate Democrats sided with Republicans on an act that the CBO says will cut the deficit by $315 billion over the next 10 years. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congre ... -rcna87223

The Act in question? Repealing Biden's student loan forgiveness program. Even a few Dems in the House agreed.



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TC Talks
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by TC Talks » Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:41 pm

bmw wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:20 pm
TC Talks wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 10:29 am
Now McCarthy has a moderate group of legislators to get the business of the country passed.
You ought to be happy about this then. A few moderate Democrats sided with Republicans on an act that the CBO says will cut the deficit by $315 billion over the next 10 years. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congre ... -rcna87223

The Act in question? Repealing Biden's student loan forgiveness program. Even a few Dems in the House agreed.
Democrats aren't nearly the lemmings House Republicans are.
Last edited by TC Talks on Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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MWmetalhead
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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:14 pm

As promised - links to historical revenue data:
https://fiscaldata.treasury.gov/america ... t-revenue/

https://www.statista.com/statistics/200 ... year-2000/

Annual revenue was double in 2022 what it was in 2012.

Revenue was virtually flat both shortly before and immediately after the Trump tax cuts took effect. Any suggestions those changes caused the deficit to balloon is utter baloney.



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Re: The Debt Limit..

Post by Mega Hertz » Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:30 pm

I've reached my limit with debt, too.


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