Covid skyrocketing in Singapore despite 83% vaccination rate

[bmw]

Singapore is reporting daily Covid cases at a per-capita rate quickly approaching where the state of Michigan was during our nasty Covid wave back in the November/December when nobody was vaccinated.

Singapore's vaccination rate among the entire population sits at 83% (and has been over 80% since August) and over 90% among people age 12+

So why the sharp increase in Covid cases? Simple. NATURAL IMMUNITY. Singapore has very little. This has been a common theme lately - the countries that did quite well during the first year and a half of Covid are eventually getting hit harder by Delta than countries that initially had higher immunity levels from prior waves - and seemingly regardless of the vaccination rate. Country after country after country after country - there is a stronger correlation between the severity of the Delta wave and past natural immunity than there is between the severity of the Delta wave and vaccination rate. Australia's numbers are through the roof compared to previous waves. Finland's have been way up for a while and sho no signs of dropping. Sweden, on the other hand, had a very muted Delta wave that barely approached 15% the daily case rate of the prior 2 waves. And what muted peak they did have has been falling for a month.

I can't easily post the graphs here. Just Google search "Covid daily report" and set the graph to Singapore or whatever country you want to look at.

I'm as confident as ever that I am correct in my position that natural immunity is far better at slowing the spread of Covid than is vaccinated immunity and that countries that engaged in strict lockdown policies last year didn't accomplish anything except delay the inevitable. I'm also confident that the various vaccine mandates are accomplishing absolutely nothing except putting people out of work and straining companies' ability to find workers.

[Turkeytop]

So, it looks like we're doing it all wrong here. Instead of getting vaccinated, we should all be doing our darndest to catch covid, so we acquire natural immunity. Or, as your twice impeached ex-President called it, "herd mentality."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2 ... 6170c01dde

[km1125]

So, it looks like we're doing it all wrong here. Instead of getting vaccinated, we should all be doing our darndest to catch covid, so we acquire natural immunity. Or, as your twice impeached ex-President called it, "herd mentality."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2 ... 6170c01dde

No, we really should be spending the bulk of our efforts learning to TREAT it EFFECTIVELY. Then, you can treat the 10% or so of the population that gets it annually instead of trying to treat 100% with some concoction of a vaccine that only has a temporary effect.

By now, we should know -without question- why some folks are affected severely and others just walk through this. it's not just age, as 100 year old folks with COPD have recovered fine and younger folks in good health succumb. There is something in common and we've spent virtually no time really trying to understand that. Knowing that, we'd be able to reduce the number of infected folks who would really need serious or urgent treatment to avoid becoming a fatality.

[bmw]

So, it looks like we're doing it all wrong here. Instead of getting vaccinated, we should all be doing our darndest to catch covid, so we acquire natural immunity...

At this point you're just trolling. This is not what I said here, nor have I ever said anywhere else in here. I'm simply pointing you to data. What conclusions you want to draw from that data is up to you.

[Turkeytop]

No, we really should be spending the bulk of our efforts learning to TREAT it EFFECTIVELY.

The hospitals are already overflowing with people who are being treated. Using your logic the rest of ust should be striving to get in there for treatment too, instead of trying to prevent infection.

[Bryce]

So, it looks like we're doing it all wrong here. Instead of getting vaccinated, we should all be doing our darndest to catch covid, so we acquire natural immunity. Or, as your twice impeached ex-President called it, "herd mentality."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2 ... 6170c01dde

I don't think that is what BMW is suggesting at all. I think his thoughts are closely aligned with mine. We should be using a targeted approach instead of the one size fits all approach that is currently being used.

Vaccinate all people 65+, any folks with compromised immune systems as well as folks with pre existing conditions that put them in a high risk for extreme illness and death. The rest of the population should be treated as if you want to be vaccinated, be my guest. If you don't, that's fine too. This way we protect the vulnerable and create natural herd immunity at the same time.

[Bryce]

The hospitals are already overflowing with people who are being treated.

I can only speak to Michigan. As of October 8th, 2021, Michigan had a total available Adult ICU bed availability of 2431 with 2007 beds occupied.

That's far from overflowing.

Did you get your overflowing information from TMZ?

[bmw]

I see Bryce beat me to a response, which largely echoes mine, but here is what I had to respond with anyways:

Yet another complete mis-representation of my position. I don't know why I'm even bothering to respond further to you, but here goes. My position, as stated multiple times in here, is that the vaccine should be mostly reserved for HIGH-RISK individuals. Have you heard of the 80-20 rule before? This rule, which can be applied to all kinds of statistics gathered from various facets of life and business, states generally that 80% of the effects come from 20% of the causes. This seems to apply to Covid as well - that 80% of the deaths and hospitalizations exist within 20% of the population. So you vaccinate that 20%. Very generally speaking - this amounts to most people over the age of 65, some people between the age of 40-65 who have underlying conditions, and only people under 40 who have significant underlying conditions.

[Turkeytop]

I can only speak to Michigan. As of October 8th, 2021, Michigan had a total available Adult ICU bed availability of 2431 with 2007 beds occupied.

That's far from overflowing.

Did you get your overflowing information from TMZ?

Hospitals are overflowing in some areas, mostly those areas with low vaccination rates like the southern US and western Canada.

In areas where we are getting the virus under control, should we all try now to get infected to take advantage of the unused hospital capacity?

Two friends of ours were successfully treated for covid in hospital, only to die a few months later from complications related to the disease.

[Bryce]

Two friends of ours were successfully treated for covid in hospital, only to die a few months later from complications related to the disease.

That's sad, and I'm sorry for the loss of your friends. By chance were they in one of the mentioned high risk groups?

[Turkeytop]

That's sad, and I'm sorry for the loss of your friends. By chance were they in one of the mentioned high risk groups?

Yes. They were both anti-vaxxers and they lived a high risk lifestyle. Out at the bars partying nearly every night.

[bmw]

Hospitals are overflowing in some areas, mostly those areas with low vaccination rates like the southern US and western Canada.

I can't speak for Canada, but in the US, this is just plain a factually untrue statement. 6 states have significantly higher daily Covid infection rates than any others, and here is their ICU data:

Alaska - 133 ICU beds, 118 in use
West Virginia - 651 ICU beds, 541 in use
Idaho - 340 ICU beds, 303 in use
Wyoming - 138 ICO beds, 89 in use
North Dakota - 209 ICU beds, 136 in use
Montana - 233 ICU beds, 208 in use

In areas where we are getting the virus under control, should we all try now to get infected to take advantage of the unused hospital capacity?

Kind of. This is less relevant this year than last year, but my position last year was that the goal, at least as far as the government is concerned, should have reached no further than flattening the curve. In other words, regulations should have been limited to ensuring that hospitals weren't overflowing. I have said that for the purpose of ending the pandemic as soon as possible, since a certain final infection number is INEVITABLE, that we're better off reaching that number sooner than later.

Two friends of ours were successfully treated for covid in hospital, only to die a few months later from complications related to the disease.

Sorry to hear that. But were they in the high-risk groups I mentioned above, and were they vaccinated?

[Turkeytop]

So other than going unvaccinated, what other positive steps are you taking to increase your chances of accessing one of those available hospital beds?

[bmw]

My statistical odds of ending up in an ICU bed, given my age and health, are minuscule. I don't know what the exact number is, but I would venture a guess that I'm more likely to end up (statistically speaking) in an ICU bed as a result of a car accident on my way to work today than I am as a result of catching and getting severely ill from Covid. By YOUR logic, I shouldn't be driving my car to work today.

[Turkeytop]

My statistical odds of ending up in an ICU bed, given my age and health, are minuscule. I don't know what the exact number is, but I would venture a guess that I'm more likely to end up (statistically speaking) in an ICU bed as a result of a car accident on my way to work today than I am as a result of catching and getting severely ill from Covid. By YOUR logic, I shouldn't be driving my car to work today.

Maybe you should try driving blindfolded. Increase your chances of getting into one of those coveted ICU beds.