You Be The Judge (again)

[km1125]

So even if you're trying to defend yourself against an aggressive co-worker who starts a fight with you, you end up getting terminated?

I can see now why former employees sue companies for not providing appropriate security. If they don't expect the employees to be able to defend themselves without getting fired then they need to provide plenty of security everywhere in the facility so their employees are never put in that situation.

[Turkeytop]

So even if you're trying to defend yourself against an aggressive co-worker who starts a fight with you, you end up getting terminated?

I can see now why former employees sue companies for not providing appropriate security. If they don't expect the employees to be able to defend themselves without getting fired then they need to provide plenty of security everywhere in the facility so their employees are never put in that situation.

When your friends are drug users and drug dealers, you're in with a bad crowd. Neither one of these guys was ever the employee of the month. No other employees got into a fight that day.

But you still haven't seen yet how this one turned out.

[Turkeytop]

If these two grievances went to arbitration it was going to cost the Company a lot of money. Arbitrator fees are typically
$2K to $3K per day plus expenses. The fees are apportioned equally between the parties. It would probably take at least two days. On top of that, the Company would have its legal expenses.

The Company's chances of winning were about 90%. They were reluctant, even with those odds, to take a chance. They clearly didn't want either of them back.

The Company's manager called me and asked met to meet with her and the grievors to discuss settlement. Before the meeting began, I met privately with the grievors. I advised then their chances of success at arbitration were very slim and they should seriously consider any settlement that was offered..

In the end, the terms of the settlement were as follows.

The Company agreed to change each of their employee records to indicate Resignation instead of Discharge.

The Company would provide each of them a neutral letter of reference.

The grievors agreed to waive any future actions or claims against the Company or the Union..

The Company Paid each of the grievors a sum of $1000. The moneys would be presented as a Tool Allowance and, therefore, would not be subject to income tax..

Both of them accepted it and signed off.

[Rate This]

The Company has no written rule against fighting.

Like most employers (except hockey teams) this employer has a zero tolerance policy for fighting. The foreman fired both of them.

I am thoroughly confused. They have no written rule but at the same time have a zero tolerance policy?

Help me out here.

It's firmly established in arbitral law, there is zero tolerance for fighting in any workplace except on the hockey rink, where it is encouraged.

No employer has a written rule that you can't piss on the boss's shoes.. But I don't believe anyone could get away with it.

That’s all well and good but usually it’s spelled out somewhere. When I worked at the bus company the first time around there was an entire paragraph that explained that fighting anywhere on property in a uniform was grounds for immediate termination. We had voted out the union and the company simply turned the final contract into their handbook to keep the drivers happy. It worked. We have no need for a union now. But things like fighting and drug use were definitely part of the union agreement.

[Calvert DeForest]

Boxing is another profession in which fighting is encouraged. In fact, it's the only way to get paid.

[Turkeytop]

Boxing is another profession in which fighting is encouraged. In fact, it's the only way to get paid.

Then, there's UFC where maiming or killing your opponent is encouraged.

[audiophile]

If these two grievances went to arbitration it was going to cost the Company a lot of money. Arbitrator fees are typically
$2K to $3K per day plus expenses. The fees are apportioned equally between the parties. It would probably take at least two days. On top of that, the Company would have its legal expenses.

The Company's chances of winning were about 90%. They were reluctant, even with those odds, to take a chance. They clearly didn't want either of them back.

The Company's manager called me and asked met to meet with her and the grievors to discuss settlement. Before the meeting began, I met privately with the grievors. I advised then their chances of success at arbitration were very slim and they should seriously consider any settlement that was offered..

In the end, the terms of the settlement were as follows.

The Company agreed to change each of their employee records to indicate Resignation instead of Discharge.

The Company would provide each of them a neutral letter of reference.

The grievors agreed to waive any future actions or claims against the Company or the Union..

The Company Paid each of the grievors a sum of $1000. The moneys would be presented as a Tool Allowance and, therefore, would not be subject to income tax..

Both of them accepted it and signed off.

Good outcome.

[MotorCityRadioFreak]

The good thing for them is that they could always get positive references from employees they didn't fight. LOL.