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Status of WSRT?

Covers all of Northern Lower Michigan (from Ludington to Tawas northward), as well as the Straits Area and Soo Region.
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MWmetalhead
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by MWmetalhead » Sun Dec 10, 2017 2:15 pm

Good luck getting ratings (and thus, revenue) with Classic Rock on two horribly disadvantaged signals.

Jacobs consulted KLQ in G.R. and 94.1 The Edge in Lansing. You're crazy if you think their services equate to some sort of guaranteed silver bullet.

If KLT is as vulnerable as you allege, which I doubt is the case to the extent you claim, then Black Diamond is running the wrong format on 105.1.

Weren't you the individual claiming how Z93 was gonna take down KHQ, or was that someone else?


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The Sage
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by The Sage » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:16 am

Z93? As much as I enjoy WTCM, I don't believe that a collection of old white men would unseat Trish and her company's flagship.

I am clearly suggesting that major market leadership will produce more revenue success than the best signals in the world with a leadership vacuum.

Black Diamond will secure what agency business exists in this market, and will out sell Northern on the street. More listeners (if you insist that a no name morning show and Terry Rae will out produce The Bears offerings) do not translate into cash all by themselves.

If that was the case, why isn't WSRT/WSRZ and The Fox top revenue leaders?

It's a shitty format being operated by a shell staff.


"Actually that's kind of the problem with Radio, for every real legend, you get about fifteen tired old gasbags who stick around too long."

Nelson
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Nelson » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:31 am

Getting back to the failure of the sale to Blarney Stone... I was really wondering what was happening. I was listening to WFCX/WFDX the other day and noticed they are going to simulcast WQON's Christmas play special coming up this Saturday. OK, that makes sense, so I thought. Then they something about copyright Northern Broadcast. Wait-- so the sale didn't go through? Apparently not! Though I do find it interesting they are still going to simulcast one of Blarney Stone's programs.



Radio Sucks
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Radio Sucks » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:38 am

Detective work time...

There have been no filings with the Feds concerning any of the Northern Broadcast stations. None of these stations have converted to online public files, so we can't go looking for a LMA or other agreement without flying to TC (it's too cold to leave my warm Quonset hut to do that).

WSRT/WSRJ never went to Baraga Radio, but WGRY-AM (now WMQU) did, at least via programming and in seven years the Coynes will donate the license to the Catholic Radio group. However, please note that the new home of Baraga Radio is in the same building right next to the Northern Broadcast stations in Traverse City (1020 Hastings Road).

Here's a Facebook photo from less than a month ago tagged with and populated by a number of WKLT employees, like Terry Ray back row right.

Image

So who wants to wander into the offices of WKLT and ask to rummage thru the public file. Doesn't an LMA agreement have to be in there?



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by MWmetalhead » Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:27 pm

This keeps getting weirder and weirder...

I wonder if the Blarney Stone folks simply wound up purchasing an equity interest in Northern Radio?


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tvbobn
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by tvbobn » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:11 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:24 am
All of the Black Diamond owned stations have unreliable indoor signals if you're listening at work on a crappy radio in the Traverse City area.

Areal coverage of 98.1/97.7 is crap and will always be crap compared to KLT/KLZ. Classic Rock is a regional format for NW Michigan. KLT/KLZ blankets pretty much the entire region with a solid signal, including the classic rock friendly US-131 corridor. The Bear fails to do so.

106.3 targets a small area around the Straits that the Petoskey and Traverse City stations are uninterested in.

105.1 & 95.5? Terrific areal coverage, but they sport a format that will never be more than a mid-pack player when it comes to revenue generation.

102.9? Nice station. Mainstay in the Petoskey & Straits areas. Not really a player in the Grand Traverse region. Primary competition is Trish's stations, not the Northern or Midwestern properties.

I guess my point is this - I don't understand the connection you are trying to make, Sage. I am hard pressed to see any scenario where Black Diamond is anything more than a second or third-tier player in the southern reaches of the market. They need better signals in that region to be any type of player there.
I just checked the distance for 98.1 and 95.5 (18.91 miles) from downtown TC as well as 97.5 (18.94 miles). All three are almost the exact distance .

WKLT is 32kW at 188 meters.
WGFN and WGFE are both 21kW at 225 meters.

With the extra height, both WGFN and WGFE should actually have a better signal into TC than WKLT. WKLT might(?) be a touch better inside a building, but not much.

I don't know why you think the coverage for WKLT is better than either WGFN or WGFE.

As to never having ratings. They're isn't many radio buys in northern Michigan based on ratings. Those national buys generally go to WTCM for the most part. The local agencies might look at the ratings, but it's "small market" buys that make the money up in northern Michigan.

All you downstate guys still seem to think that the only stations that make money in northern Michigan have to have a good signal into TC. There are several stations doing very well that are not in or near TC.

You mention WMKC (102.9) as if it's a nice little station up north by the bridge. WMKC is a cash cow that bills what most station owners only dream of billing.

Radio stations up north don't suddenly make money because of ratings, they make money with a good format and a great sales department/team!



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by MWmetalhead » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:31 pm

I don't know why you think the coverage for WKLT is better than either WGFN or WGFE.
Half of WGFN's signal goes out over Lake Michigan. It fails to deliver a usable signal to areas east of US-131. It also has a really crappy signal in Wexford County. KLT reaches Gaylord, Grayling, Cadillac and even Houghton Lake quite easily. GFN cannot be heard in any of those places and is also much weaker in Kalkaska and Antrim Counties than KLT. Charlevoix County? You can probably write off hearing GFN at all unless you're near Lake Michigan. KLT (and KLZ) blanket ALL the major vacation destinations (and all major roadways) throughout the region.

You are correct, however, that in TC proper it is on equal footing with KLT in terms of signal strength. Much of the classic rock audience in NW Michigan does not reside in the immediate TC vicinity, though.
You mention WMKC (102.9) as if it's a nice little station up north by the bridge. WMKC is a cash cow that bills what most station owners only dream of billing.
I never referred to WMKC as a "little" station, nor was that my intent.

The reason I made reference to the Grand Traverse region is because (correct me if I'm wrong here) that is Northern's primary sales area. Black Diamond's portfolio of stations favors northern regions much more than southern regions. My point is that WMKC is a revenue threat in places like Petoskey and the Straits, not places such as Traverse City.

Would be nice if 97.7 WCHY could move to the WMKC tower, increase to a Class C2 facility, and swap frequencies with Newberry's WIHC. Not sure if that chain of events would be financially or technically feasible, though.


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Realist
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Realist » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:57 pm

Here’s the interesting thing about that photo above:

Blarney Stone co-owner Cheryl Coyne is in the front row sitting while hubby Jerry is the tallest guy in the back row...


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tvbobn
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by tvbobn » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:28 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:31 pm
I don't know why you think the coverage for WKLT is better than either WGFN or WGFE.
Half of WGFN's signal goes out over Lake Michigan. It fails to deliver a usable signal to areas east of US-131. It also has a really crappy signal in Wexford County. KLT reaches Gaylord, Grayling, Cadillac and even Houghton Lake quite easily. GFN cannot be heard in any of those places and is also much weaker in Kalkaska and Antrim Counties than KLT. Charlevoix County? You can probably write off hearing GFN at all unless you're near Lake Michigan. KLT (and KLZ) blanket ALL the major vacation destinations (and all major roadways) throughout the region.

You are correct, however, that in TC proper it is on equal footing with KLT in terms of signal strength. Much of the classic rock audience in NW Michigan does not reside in the immediate TC vicinity, though.
You mention WMKC (102.9) as if it's a nice little station up north by the bridge. WMKC is a cash cow that bills what most station owners only dream of billing.
I never referred to WMKC as a "little" station, nor was that my intent.

The reason I made reference to the Grand Traverse region is because (correct me if I'm wrong here) that is Northern's primary sales area. Black Diamond's portfolio of stations favors northern regions much more than southern regions. My point is that WMKC is a revenue threat in places like Petoskey and the Straits, not places such as Traverse City.

Would be nice if 97.7 WCHY could move to the WMKC tower, increase to a Class C2 facility, and swap frequencies with Newberry's WIHC. Not sure if that chain of events would be financially or technically feasible, though.
Again, you sound like you think that ratings equal revenue, which is not the case.

Think about this, if you have a share the marbles in TC with a bunch of stations or get to keep most of the marbles in the northern region, you might end up with more marbles up north. That's the case with WMKC.

It was your "Nice station" comment that caught my attention that you didn't feel that it was much of a station. If that's not the case, I was wrong.

The major radio buys in the southern half of the market are made in TC. The stations that cover TC are the ones that get those buys. WKLT might cover more trees than the two other stations that cover a lot of water, but again, the money comes out of TC for all three of them. Those buyers are looking for TC people more than Petoskey people driving 65 miles down to TC. We could talk about this all night and end up in the same place.

Let me add something else completely. I hope they're better broadcasters than photographer's, because those are very poor group pictures. You can see the people up front and every one in the back are silhouettes. Someone needs a better flash to take the pictures next time.

Seems like a lot of people working for this cluster of radio stations.



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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Radio Sucks » Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:18 am

Our fearless leader and expert on bankruptcy wrote:I wonder if the Blarney Stone folks simply wound up purchasing an equity interest in Northern Radio?
They would still have to file that with the Feds. Last filing shows 100% ownership by the North Dakota Pepsi guy.



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by MWmetalhead » Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:06 am

Again, you sound like you think that ratings equal revenue, which is not the case.

Think about this, if you have a share the marbles in TC with a bunch of stations or get to keep most of the marbles in the northern region, you might end up with more marbles up north. That's the case with WMKC.
The market is more-or-less bifurcated, right? Some owners largely focus on the northern region because that's where they draw the bulk of their listenership & advertising (based on signal footprint). Others largely focus on the southern region.
It was your "Nice station" comment that caught my attention that you didn't feel that it was much of a station. If that's not the case, I was wrong.
I was not at all trying to be sarcastic with that remark; I meant it as a compliment.
The major radio buys in the southern half of the market are made in TC. The stations that cover TC are the ones that get those buys. WKLT might cover more trees than the two other stations that cover a lot of water, but again, the money comes out of TC for all three of them.
KLT's advertiser base is more diverse than you give them credit for, although I will agree that TC drives a sizable percentage of their ad revenue. I'll re-state one of my earlier points - Classic Rock is a REGIONAL format for Northern Michigan. The geographic dispersion of advertisers on KLT reflects that fact. There are plenty of people who drive from Kalkaska and Antrim Counties to do business in Traverse City, too; The Bear's signal flat out stinks in those areas if listening indoors.

There is tourism business-oriented advertising placed on Northern MI radio stations; seems to me having strong regional coverage and a longstanding successful brand would be beneficial in attracting those ad dollars.

The only way I see The Bear being a substantial revenue threat to KLT is if KLT's top sales people leave & go across the street to work for Black Diamond.


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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by The Sage » Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:13 am

MW, I think TV Bob has done a good assessment. Trees in adjacent counties and the people who live amongst them are not valuable listeners, because they shop at Wal-Mart and Meijer and usually have one choice for Chevys or other durable goods. There just isn't competition like there is in TC or Petoskey.

As for trying to advertise to reach tourists? That would be a waste of money, unless you are selling gas or ice cream. Visitors who are spending time in a car typically hit the national chain restaurants before heading back to the suburbs of Michigan. That's why McDonalds and Burger King are frequently advertising.

It's content not quantity in this market. Beiderman and MacDonald are the leaders, the race is for third place, and Black Diamond will trounce Northern.

Being honest, I would say you're sounding like Randy Michaels, but I enjoy your commentary too much to accuse you of that.


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MWmetalhead
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by MWmetalhead » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:01 am

Will be fun to see where things stand a couple years from now. I just don't see Black Diamond making a big impact in the south half of the market. I think KLT is a much better product overall than The Bear.

Black Diamond will own the Straits, they probably already do.

Petoskey, Charlevoix and Boynes will remain Trish territory.


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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by ftballfan » Wed Dec 13, 2017 8:50 am

MWmetalhead wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:01 am
Will be fun to see where things stand a couple years from now. I just don't see Black Diamond making a big impact in the south half of the market. I think KLT is a much better product overall than The Bear.

Black Diamond will own the Straits, they probably already do.

Petoskey, Charlevoix and Boynes will remain Trish territory.
I take it Midwestern is dominant in the TC/Cadillac/Manistee area. In the southern half of the market, BD likely only makes an impact in Benzie and Manistee (where none of Coyne's or Trish's stations reach well).



organman95
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by organman95 » Wed Dec 13, 2017 9:56 am

Del already had the Straits for YEARS. I don't think anyone can touch those stations. Black Diamond has nothing to worry about up there.



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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by A1B1C1D1 » Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:57 pm

"Please note that the new home of Baraga Radio is in the same building right next to the Northern Broadcast stations in Traverse City (1020 Hastings Road)."

Yes. I was of the understanding that when Baraga moved from Central Michigan to Traverse City, they were paying Northern to program their stations and use some of their equipment. Advertising isn't the only revenue source in radio. I don't think Baraga has a paid staff.

Catholic media is pathetically funded compared to protestant media, though Catholic talk radio is considered more engaging. I was always skeptical how long they could afford a 100kw energy bill, though the highway coverage was impressive.

I don't know the status of these stations, but I do know when Yob paid $700K for a couple of AM's (TC translator) it changed the value of every station reaching Traverse City.

Maybe the future of radio is wealthy people paying big to push their politics, move lobbying from the halls of government directly to the people. LA Weekly magazine is the latest example.



Radio Sucks
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Radio Sucks » Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:19 am

Someone who's screen name makes me sing the Alphabet Song wrote:I don't know the status of these stations, but I do know when Yob paid $700K for a couple of AM's (TC translator) it changed the value of every station reaching Traverse City.
Only if the seller wants to finance the sale, something that I'm somewhat positive North Dakota Pepsi guy did not want to do. Yob (AKA Mitten News LLC) put 150K down payment on closing, the rest
The lawyer who prepared the Asset Sales Agreement for John Yob wrote:The balance of Five Hundred Fifty Thousand Dollars ($550,000.00) shall be evidenced by a Promissory Note in standard form as attached in Exhibit 9, such Note to bear simple interest at 3% per annum amortized over a period of ten (10) years

The note is due in two years, but I believe the "10 year amortization" mentioned above gives the parties the chance to extend the life of the note if Yob's mitten isn't stuffed with cash.

Later in the agreement, the three licenses (two AM's plus the TC translator) without real estate or equipment were valued around $200,000. Which is still a lot.



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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by ftballfan » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:05 am

On a related note to Yob's purchase of WJML/WJNL for 700K, how much did Henderson buy WLDR for? I know that was very high (in the millions)



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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Mars » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:00 pm

ftballfan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:05 am
On a related note to Yob's purchase of WJML/WJNL for 700K, how much did Henderson buy WLDR for? I know that was very high (in the millions)
IIRC it was about 3.8 M give or take a few thou.



Nelson
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Re: Status of WSRT?

Post by Nelson » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:01 pm

Man, that seems like a lot of money. For 'JML and 'LDR.



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