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Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Discussion pertaining to Detroit, Ann Arbor, Port Huron, and SW Ontario
innate-in-you
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Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by innate-in-you » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:04 pm

Driving home from work several days ago, I had been listening to WDTW (AM) on the way home from work, and I was surprised to hear them make their pattern change (2 tower DA to 6 tower DA) at 5:15 PM, when there was plenty of daylight left in the day.

Another day, I noted that they had a strong signal just before sunrise as I left for work. At the time, I had just assumed that propagation was just better than average that morning.

Further listening revealed that they are consistently making the night-to-day pattern change at 6:45 AM EST (1345 UTC) and the day-to-night change at 5:15 PM EST (1015 UTC).

So, it would appear that this month (February), they are changing both their night pattern and their night pattern some 45 minutes early.

There is NO month in which WDTW is scheduled to change the pattern from night-to-day at 6:45 EST (1145 UTC) and change the pattern from night-to-day at 17:15 EST (2215 UTC).

Only in November is WDTW scheduled to change from day-to-night at 2215 UTC, and only in October are they scheduled to change from night-to-day at 1145 UTC, the latter surprising as the autumnal equinox is in September.

Is there any reason for WDTW to go to night pattern early? Is 1310 a clear channel in Canada though it is regional in USA (790 and 1260 are class A channels in Canada, notable that the end of Sudbury's 790 leaves a clear channel abandoned!), Is WDTW providing critical-hours protection to CIWW (absurd, as CIWW's NIF is >10mV/m).

Or is WDTW's clock just 45 minutes fast?
Last edited by innate-in-you on Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:21 pm, edited 6 times in total.



Arthur Mometer
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Re: Day and night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Arthur Mometer » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:19 pm

Duplicate post.
Last edited by Arthur Mometer on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.


"I'm meteorologist Arthur Mometer."

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Arthur Mometer
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Re: Day and night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Arthur Mometer » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:20 pm

innate-in-you wrote:
Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:04 pm
Driving home from work several days ago, I had been listening to WDTW (AM) on the way home from work, and I was surprised to hear them make their pattern change (2 tower DA to 6 tower DA) at 5:15 PM, when there was plenty of daylight left in the day.

Another day, I noted that they had a strong signal just before sunrise as I left for work. At the time, I had just assumed that propagation was just better than average that morning.

Further listening revealed that they are consistently making the night-to-day pattern change at 6:45 AM EST (1345 UTC) and the day-to-night change at 5:15 PM EST (1015 UTC).

....wprk in progress
My guess is that they don't automatically reset at the beginning of the month. I would get the FCC Sunrise Sunset Program, input the coordinates, and get a list of the monthly times. If there's some way to put those in automatically to a program which controls the switching, do that. DST does throw a monkey wrench into things though. Its a little different because its the 15th of the month SR SS time rounded to the nearest 15 minutes.

Quick way to determine if it's considered to be day or night-check if WNZK is on 690 or 680. WLSP 1530 or WYGR 1530 or KTGG 1540 might also settle it, on or off.

Also a good way to set yard light timers, to get an overview of the next three months or so. You don't need to worry about DST for that.


"I'm meteorologist Arthur Mometer."

"Those of you who think you know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."

"Lies have to be repeated and repeated to be believed. Truth stands on its own merit."

JGP1954
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Re: Day and night at WDTW (AM)

Post by JGP1954 » Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:10 pm

I suspect the station is highly automated, and that's the problem. Also, I must mention for being 5kw at 1310AM, their signal really pops. Recently, I was up near Lapeer, and it had great signal. Then, I was down in Toledo and same thing. It always had a decent signal, but with those new sticks, it really pops.



innate-in-you
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by innate-in-you » Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:01 pm

To see the radiation plot on the FCC site, it has an extremely strong augmentation on its Southern daytime lobe.

WDTW (AM) does not have the usual buried ground radial system. Each of its six towers has a ground plane of six radials made of wire (it looks like six gigantic CB ground plane antennas).

This saves a lot of money, and deters the copper thieves that have taken some stations off the air, sometimes for good.

The surprise is that some AMs are getting better coverage than equivalent systems with the traditional ground radials!



Arthur Mometer
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Arthur Mometer » Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:19 pm

The acceptance of that large of an augmentation is problematic to me. I noticed that a year or so ago. You do realize that there is only 5000 watts to radiate. If it's going South, there has to be a real reduction to the North, or somewhere, like above the horizon. I learned this from Carl Smith's circa 1947 DA chapter in the NAB Engineering Handbook from 1949. It's available on americanradiohistory.com. Think about it. It's a Corollary of the First Law Of Thermodyamics. The Second Law is there too, with the system losses. He doesn't label it as such, but that's the principle.

You do know that Carl Smith owned the American Gothic House in Iowa, don't you? Contemplating that Pitchfork is where he got the idea for the three tower inline endfire binomial design array.

Image


"I'm meteorologist Arthur Mometer."

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"Lies have to be repeated and repeated to be believed. Truth stands on its own merit."

innate-in-you
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by innate-in-you » Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:07 pm

It's tough to make it in the 50+ demo in Iowa, with a three tower array, no less, when one considers WHO the competition is.



Deleted User 9015

Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Deleted User 9015 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:14 am

I miss the good ole days when Air America broadcasted from WDTW.



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Ben Zonia
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Ben Zonia » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:32 am

I remember when those Carl Smith CIE cards and flyers used to fly out of every magazine oriented toward men, and in the mail too. Reminds me of the Hogwarts flyers in the Harry Potter movie.


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Mega Hertz
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Mega Hertz » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:57 am

Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:14 am
I miss the good ole days when Air America broadcasted from WDTW.
Dafuq?

Mister, where in HELL have you been? We've been worried sick! Your mother almost called the police!


"Internet is no more like radio than intravenous feeding is like fine dining."
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borderboy653659200
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Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by borderboy653659200 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:58 am

You and I both,Neckbeard .Now it's a steady parade of crypto-Fascist,Trump-worshipping wing nuts on the airwaves.



Deleted User 9015

Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Deleted User 9015 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:24 am

Mega Hertz wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:57 am
Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:14 am
I miss the good ole days when Air America broadcasted from WDTW.
Dafuq?

Mister, where in HELL have you been? We've been worried sick! Your mother almost called the police!
lol 5 years isnt that long is it



Mega Hertz
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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:09 pm
Location: Brighton

Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Mega Hertz » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:37 pm

Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:24 am
Mega Hertz wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:57 am
Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:14 am
I miss the good ole days when Air America broadcasted from WDTW.
Dafuq?

Mister, where in HELL have you been? We've been worried sick! Your mother almost called the police!
lol 5 years isnt that long is it
These days? Five minutes feels like 5 years.

Oh the shit you've missed...hoooooooo boy lol


"Internet is no more like radio than intravenous feeding is like fine dining."
-TurkeyTop

Deleted User 9015

Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Deleted User 9015 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:04 pm

Mega Hertz wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:37 pm
Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:24 am
Mega Hertz wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:57 am
Neckbeard wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:14 am
I miss the good ole days when Air America broadcasted from WDTW.
Dafuq?

Mister, where in HELL have you been? We've been worried sick! Your mother almost called the police!
lol 5 years isnt that long is it
These days? Five minutes feels like 5 years.

Oh the shit you've missed...hoooooooo boy lol
I'm sure the 2016 election was fun. Did someone explain to someone else why their politics are wrong?



Mega Hertz
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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:09 pm
Location: Brighton

Re: Day & Night at WDTW (AM)

Post by Mega Hertz » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:41 pm

It's only gotten worse, my friend. But I don't wanna make this thread political. Join the PolPot for all your aneurysm needs.


"Internet is no more like radio than intravenous feeding is like fine dining."
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