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Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Discussion pertaining to Detroit, Ann Arbor, Port Huron, and SW Ontario
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MWmetalhead
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Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Tue May 09, 2017 8:46 pm

(Update #1: I am pleased to report the issues described in the following post were fixed this past Tuesday, May 16. Station sounds MUCH better now!)

(Update #2: As of May 25, the audio sounds noticeably "off" again. Granted, the problems aren't as severe as a few weeks ago, but still frustrating nonetheless.)

What brain-dead, pot smoking MORON is responsible for WRIF's audio settings for music???

I'd be embarrassed to be responsible for a station that sounds so limp!

Cymbals partially drowning out the guitar, as well as the vocals, with absolutely ZERO bass response. "For Whom the Bell Tollls" sounded fucking AWFUL just now, thanks to the incompetence of the dummies at the Beasley Media complex.

I'm only using that song as an example. EVERY hard rocking song - at least every song that is supposed to be hard rocking - is made to sound like horseshit. This issue has been ongoing for months!

Until a week or so ago, the top-end was also washing out quite noticeably. I've heard stations in rural Ohio whose audio processing is far superior.

How pitiful is it that WNIC, WOMC and even WMUZ have 1000% better bass response than the market's (supposed) rock station, WRIF?!!

People understandably mock the crummy sounding audio on satellite radio, but I'll take the audio processing on Octane, Lithium, Ozzy's Boneyard and Liquid Metal any day of the week over WRIF. I've probably spent a grand total of 30 minutes listening to WRIF over the past month because of this issue. I stick around for two songs at most, then I'm gone.

This sucks - because I actually like a lot of the music WRIF is playing these days.
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Colonel Flagg
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by Colonel Flagg » Wed May 10, 2017 12:24 pm

I agree. Sounds terrible. Perhaps the Voltair got plugged back in again. Always be leery of geeks who claim to know how to set up audio processing. They are usually tone deaf, and completely full of shit. The late Paul Christie, love him or hate him, knew how to set up an audio chain.
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audiophile
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Thu May 11, 2017 4:45 am

Are you listening to it in HD MW? The HD sounds tinny and worse than the analog's bass - and the codec sounds like satellite radio.

The bass is very homogenized and peaked in the mid-bass region. Kick drums are barely audible, the bass guitar just drones.

This is often done to be loud. By setting the bass clipper threshold too low the bass will lack punch, but allow the final drive to be increased and be louder.

I didn't hear the HF wash out in analog, but I didn't listen for long and my receiver was blending.

I will say, trying to get a rock station not to sound hyper-compressed is hard. You have to work at it and be willing to give up loudness. If you are clueless try the Urban AC preset. It will at least allow some punch for the rock formatted station.
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syntheticexctasy
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by syntheticexctasy » Thu May 11, 2017 9:35 am

What I hear on the analog audio (HD has always sounded like garbage in comparison) is what sounds like too much low quality digital overprocessing.

It's funny that you mention "for whom the bell tolls" because I've noticed the SAME exact thing anytime they've played that.

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MWmetalhead
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu May 11, 2017 5:11 pm

Punch is EXACTLY what their audio chain needs!!! And I agree...the analog side reeks of digital overprocessing.

There is no depth or dimension at all to the bass.

The sad thing is, until a couple years ago, WRIF's audio usually sounded damn good. Issues were generally short lived. Not anymore!
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Thu May 11, 2017 5:28 pm

It might be Beasley "corporate" settings if it's a new problem.
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu May 11, 2017 9:49 pm

Dates back to Greater Media. Not long after Beasley took over, it began to sound better only to revert to the wishy washy sound we all now "enjoy."

WRIF's Web stream has always sounded terrible. Guess it was time for the FM broadcast to match!
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu May 11, 2017 9:51 pm

I will say WNIC has the best sounding processing of all stations in the market, including deep, rich bass.
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by WOHO » Fri May 12, 2017 1:46 pm

Why does CBS ramp the bass so thick on WWJ? It's bad enough on analog, but it's a window-rattler on HD from WWJ.
Granted, a lot, if not most, radio listening goes on in the car instead of on your Lafayette, Fisher, or McIntosh tuner at home, so my guess is that they are simply going for freaking 'loudness' that road noise will mask their horseshit processing. It's sad that we have lost so much dynamic range on any channel but NPR classical, and the 'look ahead' typically pulls back a big drum kick, compared to it's vinyl version.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Fri May 12, 2017 4:28 pm

A look-ahead limiter is helpful reducing the amount of clipping and intermod, but on the downside it lowers the "punch".

One the benefits (or theories) of using a feedback compressor for the LF band was to allow the initial punch before the compressor reacted. That wasn't really needed...a feed-forward compressor could simply have a resistor-capacitor combination that created a slower attack-time. Feed-forward compressors are much harder to design, but they are vastly superior.
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bmw
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by bmw » Fri May 12, 2017 10:18 pm

Isn't there an FCC regulation that says a station's HD must sound AT LEAST as good as the analog?

I guess the only way to comply if your HD sounds like crap is to lower the analog to match.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Sat May 13, 2017 6:54 am

No, because that is subjective. The FCC gave up on quality measurements in the middle 1980's...
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bmw
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by bmw » Sat May 13, 2017 9:42 am

Found it.
We expect and intend that the fundamental use of DAB will be for the provision of free over-the-air radio service. We will, therefore, require radio stations to provide at least one free digital over-the-air audio broadcast service. Specifically, radio stations operating in a digital mode must provide one free digital audio programming service that is comparable to or better in audio quality than that of their current analog service.
https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attac ... 7-33A1.pdf

See paragraph 28.

So there you have it. If your digital stream sucks, you can come into compliance in two ways - either fix your digital audio, or degrade your analog audio to suck at least as bad or worse than your digital stream.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Sat May 13, 2017 10:10 am

Again, it's subjective and there is no enforcement mechanism (or even that you have test it). If you put a 1 kHz tone generator on the HD the specs would be great. It's the complex changing waveforms it can't keep up with.

However BMW, this would be an interesting experiment if someone actually complained about the HD audio quality. My guess is nothing would happen.
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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Tue May 16, 2017 5:52 pm

To whomever at Beasley Media who decided to *finally* take action (after months of horrendous sounding audio) - THANK YOU!!!

I noticed that WRIF seemed to be operating on auxiliary facilities on & off over the past couple days while the processing issues were corrected.

Today, when I drove home from work, the music sounded considerably better than it it did last week. "Freak on a Leash" by Korn had a decent amount of bass response and good dynamic range.

The previous thirty or forty times, that same song sounded garbled & mushy. Not today.

Hopefully, the improved sound settings are permanent. I can once again include WRIF in my music listening repertoire. In the car, I had been listening to Sirius XM almost exclusively for rock music for the past several months.
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Fri May 19, 2017 7:39 am

I've been listening to WRIF a lot over the past couple days - the new settings make the music a LOT more enjoyable than before!!! I love the new settings!!!

Thanks again to whomever took action! :)
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounded like HORSESHIT!!! (But not anymore!)

Post by syntheticexctasy » Tue May 23, 2017 11:50 am

I was listening last night and still heard the "bells" type sound ringing out with any guitar riffs. Will take a listen again today.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu May 25, 2017 6:46 pm

I agree with you, SE.

Through last weekend, WRIF's audio processing sounded very good.

These past few days, I hear audible hissing during quiet parts of songs, the bass doesn't sound as rich as it did last week, and I am also hearing digital compression artifacts.

Why on earth did these dummies have to tinker with the settings again?!?!? Last week, they were PERFECT. Everything should've been left alone!!! Un-f*cking-believable.
C'mon iHeartRadio - do the RIGHT thing for once! Please cancel "Rover's Morning Glory" from WBFX in Grand Rapids.

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by audiophile » Fri May 26, 2017 6:13 am

I briefly tuned in yesterday afternoon and wasn't impressed. Bass still felt homogenized.
Ask not what your country can do FOR you; ask what they are about to do TO YOU!!

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Re: Hey WRIF: your audio chain sounds like HORSESHIT!!!

Post by syntheticexctasy » Fri May 26, 2017 10:26 pm

kind of a disappointment with such a strong signal.

there are high school stations in the area with tiny footprints, but much bigger, better sounding audio (And a lot of time, a lot more interesting music)

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